Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

Discussion of 4-Cam Type 547 engines (and all the Fuhrmann racing variants) and cars that powered them.
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Harlan Halsey
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#16 Post by Harlan Halsey »

The Idea to substitute a Corvair filter for the Porsche filter was Chuck Forge's in the 1960s. Jim Wellington made a number of these conversions back then. And naturally I have been running one on my Carrera since 1982.

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Joris Koning
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#17 Post by Joris Koning »

I think as usual Rainer has nailed it. Going to look into this. @Rainer, would you mind sharing the part number for the filer element?
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Rainer Cooney
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#18 Post by Rainer Cooney »

I'll go one better than that. Here are my drawings, feel free to make some. I'm restricted to manual machines here at The Spyder Factory and this usually doesn't hold me back because I make very small volumes of parts and get good money for them. These filter adapters, for me with my machines, take WAY too much time to make and consequently I'm embarrassed to ask for the money to fabricate them. So often times I'm just "sold out" to make life easier. The filter element I use is a Mahle OX 416 D2 which has a much better inner seal than the previous NAPA filter I used but also required a redesign of some dimensions.
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6991D213-9D32-4E5A-8C20-322FEC54C861.jpeg
76F50437-2914-43D1-ABBF-7A9808AF999E.jpeg
Last edited by Rainer Cooney on Sun Feb 19, 2023 11:36 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Jacques Lefriant
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#19 Post by Jacques Lefriant »

Have you guys made the environmental impact study on this endeavor taking everything in account it could result in .000000001 increase degree Centigrade per year.
 

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Chuck House
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#20 Post by Chuck House »

Jeff, thanks for the heads up on the Wix filter. I haven't had any issue on the few that I've used. Could this be a difference between roller and plain bearing engines as rollers generally have lower oil pressures? The Corvair guys seem to like the Wix so I don't think it's filter quality.

I like Rainer's setup but guess I was too lazy to do the lathe work for the caps.😄
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Bill Sargent
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#21 Post by Bill Sargent »

Rainer - many thanks for sharing your drawings!

To save everyone from duplicate effort I am willing to do the following:
  • I have a CAD work station and will get the parts into CAD
  • I will then 3D print prototype parts in plastic and send to Rainer to check fit etc. Hopefully he is willing to help with this step.
  • once the prototype parts are good to go I can get a quote to make as many sets as there is interest in. I typically use an online CNC service like HUBS.com.
  • my CAD time is free and the price per set would be at cost plus shipping.
I would normally have something like this CNC machined from aluminum, but given that the part is in a low stress environment and not subject to temperatures over about 250F, it might be possible to 3D print functional plastic parts. This would significantly reduce the cost. And the file could then be shared and people could have their own printed.

Could I please ask for thoughts on CNC machining from aluminum vs 3D printed plastic?

Another thing I am interested in is reproducing the filter cup - but I would need an original to build a CAD model from. Jeff and Joris said they may have one I could purchase so hopefully I can also progress that part of the project. Having a CAD model would make it relatively easy to do the 356 Carrera cup or the taller 904 cup.
Last edited by Bill Sargent on Sat Feb 18, 2023 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bill Sargent
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#22 Post by Bill Sargent »

All - I cleaned up Rainer’s drawings so they are easier to read. See below. NOTE THAT THE 36 MM ID SHOWN IN THE TOP PART DIAGRAM SHOULD BE 32MM!
EFFF731A-1091-4BD1-8A99-E23EEF2710E7.jpeg
5CAB63D7-4774-4D76-BD37-D1923B64E9CF.jpeg
As for making the parts, I have been doing this for a few years and Rainers parts are fairly simply. A more complex recent project was 904 hood and rear compartment latch sets.
5EE62F3B-4B97-4983-BDAD-5C2664D3B16B.jpeg
Last edited by Bill Sargent on Sun Feb 19, 2023 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bill Sargent
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#23 Post by Bill Sargent »

One more request to Rainer - could you please post a close up photo of the O-ring groove on the lower cap part? I want to make sure I have it correct.
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Jeff Adams
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#24 Post by Jeff Adams »

Chuck - not all the Wix filters we installed failed, I think the mood of the Porsche gods and chaos theory is what determined which ones leaked. Seal failure rate on the PH4 was zero so we went back to those and stayed the course.

The oil filter circuit is on the scavenge side of the oil pump so roller versus plain bearing pumps is not really a factor here.

Rainer's conversion is very nice, but only works if you have the original Mann cup and bolt. Several customer cars have been converted and the original cups lost to time, so the PH4 conversion kit is still relevant.

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Bill Sargent
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#25 Post by Bill Sargent »

I took a couple of hours this afternoon and built a CAD model from Rainer’s drawings and did a rough costing to make 10 sets of adapter parts. Making the parts from aluminum and using viton O-rings gave me a per set cost of about $80/set. Making 20 sets would lower the per set cost to about $50/set. There are significant economies of scale when having parts CNC machined.

I still need to confirm some things with Rainer regarding one dimension and possible addition of an O-ring seal on the top adapter part but the costs are reasonable ball park numbers.

Could I please ask the 4 cam group to indicate interest in purchase, and how many?

Regarding Jeff’s point about the original cups being lost, it would be easy to create a CAD model of the cup and reproduce them too. They would be CNC machined, but once lightly shot peened on the outside would look similar enough to the original cup that you would need to look closely in a Carrera engine compartment to notice. I will talk further with Jeff and Joris about access to an original cup.

Below is a screen shot of the CAD model of the adapter parts.
5427A592-11A7-4AC7-85D4-93126E7503D3.jpeg
5427A592-11A7-4AC7-85D4-93126E7503D3.jpeg (21.79 KiB) Viewed 1907 times
Regards,

Bill Sargent
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Joris Koning
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#26 Post by Joris Koning »

Hi Bill,

I will take 4 sets. Will check with some 4-cam friends to gage their needs.

Best

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Joris Koning
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#27 Post by Joris Koning »

Make that 10 sets Bill
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#28 Post by Rainer Cooney »

Bill has brought it to my attention that the I.D. bore of the top cap was in error. My fault as the final drawing never made it into my binder. The drawing has been up dated to reflect the now 32mm bore. Lastly it is my sincere hope that should these be produced on a larger scale a good local machinist is used and not some faceless off shore company that offers a free ballon delivery service.

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Chuck House
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#29 Post by Chuck House »

Bill, I'll take two sets.

I'd also like to give a shout out to Rainer for developing this. When I finally did my 547/1 engine in 2021, Rainer was a tremendous help whenever I had a question as were Jacques and Bob Garretson with advice and a few parts. I can't say enough about the generosity of all three!
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Jacques Lefriant
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Re: Carrera oil filter - adaptor for spin on filter

#30 Post by Jacques Lefriant »

Hi Bill
i can have them done for you and i can get the bowls cast i don't see the need for the top if whoever is doing them keeps at it.
j
 

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