Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

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Graham Kerr
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#16 Post by Graham Kerr »

Hey Brad you might want to check out the tale under UK Outlaw where I fitted early, short wheelbase rear arms so I could utilise the existing 356 torsion bars and their location and added Koni coil over to the mix for additional help. The trans I have is a 915 which I believe is slightly larger than the 901 you intend to fit.
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#17 Post by Nathan Miller »

Brad K wrote: Wed Mar 31, 2021 2:40 pm hi - i looked at this a while back - here is part of what i wrote on a prior thread - check out excellence magazine, September 2007, pgs. 100-105 - this article is about a T-6 outlaw/track/racer with a type IV engine, 901 tranny, and 911 SWB rear suspension install - i defer to those with actual experience - i was told that if you this conversion, it is very difficult to go back to stock, and i can imagine the swb 911 parts are more difficult to find, and expensive
Is that issue #158 with "802-hp Daily Driver" on the cover?

Hanns Mueller-Rech
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#18 Post by Hanns Mueller-Rech »

there should also be also taken a look at Alois Ruf his
356.11 aka 56.11 with the Polo engine in the back…
he had some units bought, the rumours said..

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Martin Benade
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#19 Post by Martin Benade »

I have an unproven theory that adding a 901 rear suspension with much better geometry wouldn’t necessarily improve a 356. The original suspension has terrible geometry at both ends, each one having its own very different problems. Somehow it works well.
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Nick Warinner
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#20 Post by Nick Warinner »

I've done a couple. There isn't a benefit to swapping the 911 torsion bar because, from fading memory, the 911 torsion bar is about 10mm wider. Much easier to fabricate the tabs for trailing arms and weld them in place along with 2 bungs for the 901 transmission mount(if converting to 901 as well). You will need the complete 64-68 911 rear suspension. The S and L models had vented disc brakes and sway bars. Try to find a set of trailing arms with the sway bar ball mounts on them but if not they can be added.

Alan Klingen 2
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#21 Post by Alan Klingen 2 »

The person to talk to is Ron La Dow he did just that and put in a 911 5 speed to boot. Ron is at Precision Matters his engineering company. Alan The Stable. And Happy Thanks giving! all you 356 head!! Alan The Stable.!!!

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Jacques Lefriant
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#22 Post by Jacques Lefriant »

Hi
replacing the complete torsion bar is a big project to incorporate.The 911 trailing arms only need the center portion. they used to be easy to find now some enterpeising firm could just make the boxes for the tip of the trailing arms and add them to the present tube. you have to let the spring plate go lower the easiest way is to delete the lowest aft bolt but you can be more inventive. The trailng arms must be modified for the shock purchase. If you use a 901 transmission have the nose cone modyfied to allow the box to be mounted closer to the front. Emory motorsports has perfected this conversion but any ugly rockie attempt will if done with some though and a capable fabricator achieve the desired result. If someone has a good coil over conversion i would be intersted in seeing pictures.
TIA
j
 

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Graham Kerr
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#23 Post by Graham Kerr »

I'm a bit late to chat on this subject, but, I wanted to say this conversion to 911 rear suspension is far from easy. There is a whole lot of measuring to be done, you are going to need short wheelbase early 911 torsion plates and trailing arms - banana arms and you are going to need a big boy TIG welder, a Lincoln or similar, I don't think Harbour freight will cut it. I didn't run the torsion bars but elected to go with Koni coil overs for their adjustability. I retained the torsion bar tube but could have easily fabricated a stand alone crossmember but without a Celete jig I kept the torsion tube as a measurement guide basis. My gearbox is a type 915 and I mounted it on a stock 911 trans crossmember attached to the torsion tube. I welded the mounts for the trailing arms onto the torsion tube following detailed measurement and for the mounts I used 3/8th and 1/4" plate hence the need for a decent weld. I made all the mounts extra beefy as I knew I would be putting upwards of 300 brake through them. I got Elephant bronze bushings for the torsion plate ends, not cheap but very good quality then at the hub end of the plates welded a substantial mount for the Konis after much measurement and alignment. A further 1/4" plate top mount got sited above in the wheel arch area. Slicing up the torsion plates for the hubs I was able to site the rear wheel dead centre in the wheel arch plus I gave the wheel zero camber. I'm running 7" x 16" Fuchs on the back and they fit with a good half to three quarters of an inch clearance with no need to start chopping up the fender. I did have beefed up driveshafts made but I can't recall if these were narrower or not. Obviously I've just glossed over what I did but I wanted to point out that this isn't a weekend job and it has to be done right, I will say that I've given my car a good thrashing round the track and it really handles very good indeed, so a worthwhile conversion.
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86 SSE Turbo Look 3.2 Carrera
Cole Foster Chop
75 Honda ST70
94 Buell ST2
74 Dax Cobra
18 Macan Turbo
62 356B T6 (modified)

Alan Klingen 2
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#24 Post by Alan Klingen 2 »

You could talk to Ron La Dow he that exactly He also put in A 911 901 5 speed tranny. His web site is Precision Matters. Alan The Stable.

Mark Schumacher
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#25 Post by Mark Schumacher »

I took the easy way out and bought a 912 project car. My 356 Outlaw has the 17mm front torsion bar and rear Skirmants camber regulator. On the track, the 912 does handle better but the 356 is very good.

Nathan Miller
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#26 Post by Nathan Miller »

What is the best way to find/buy a SWB 911/912 rear suspension? I have been watching eBay and there are trailing arms and a couple of other parts, but it seems that finding the whole suspension is the way to go.

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Jules Dielen
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#27 Post by Jules Dielen »

Look for a car with the front end smashed. BhCC has pristine examples from time to time
Jules

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Nathan Miller
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#28 Post by Nathan Miller »

Per Jules advice, I found a beat up 912 at BHCC. I just want the rear suspension and the transmission. Does anybody want to buy the rest of it? And here is where I show my ignorance. Would substituting a 914 rear suspension be any more difficult that swapping a 912 rear suspension? Oddly enough, I have a 914 5 speed 901 that already has the reverse ring and pinion.

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Martin Benade
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#29 Post by Martin Benade »

Reversed for rear engine use? That should have the better top gear ratio.
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Alan Klingen 2
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Re: Converting the rear suspension to 911 style

#30 Post by Alan Klingen 2 »

Ron La Dow did this exactly and even installed a 901 5 speed!!! He is at Precision Matters and did a twin plug 356 motor!! We did all testing at my shop The Stable, Alan The He did a full flow oil filter set-up.Alan The Stable.

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