Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

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DaveErickson
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Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#1 Post by DaveErickson » Fri Jan 14, 2022 2:05 pm

I'm working on the trunk of my 59 D, currently cleaning up the wiring. There are a couple things that I would like the Carrera experts to comment on. First, there is an extra green wire coiled on the passenger side (in addition to the fog light wire). Second, there are a pair of large holes in the inner fender right above the coil of green wire. The holes are covered with some kind of putty that has hardened almost as hard as the steel fender. Photos below with holes and wire circled, trunk side and wheel well side. Is this the setup for a stock Carrera electric fuel pump? I would like to see some photos of an installed pump. Also, is the black putty the way the factory sealed the holes or is this an indication that at one time there was a fuel pump installed? Do all D's have this wire and the holes in the fender?

The photo of Greg Bryan's color coded wiring diagram shows the green wire to an optional Carrera fuel pump.

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Justin Rio
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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#2 Post by Justin Rio » Fri Jan 14, 2022 5:49 pm

Not an expert but that wire lead passed through the bulkhead wall down here...
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DaveErickson
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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#3 Post by DaveErickson » Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:02 pm

Oh, if only these cars could tell us their stories. Justin, from there where does the wire go? Passenger foot well?

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Vic Skirmants
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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#4 Post by Vic Skirmants » Sat Jan 15, 2022 8:40 am

The dual pumps in a Carrera were bolted to the torsion bar tubes.

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#5 Post by Bill Sargent » Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:30 am

The green wire may indeed be for a fuel pump. As Vic says, the carrera fuel pumps (twin auto pulse pumps) were installed on the upper torsion bar tube with a special bracket. When the carrera fuel pumps are installed there are two extra holes about 12mm diameter in the forward part of the center tunnel for the fuel line to go out to and come back in from the fuel pump. But there were no holes in the inner fender associated with a carrera fuel pump. Or with the carrera hard oil lines either for that matter. My guess is that at an owner at some point installed the green wire, possibly for a fuel pump.
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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#6 Post by DaveErickson » Mon Jan 17, 2022 12:20 am

Bill Sargent wrote:
Sun Jan 16, 2022 2:30 am
But there were no holes in the inner fender associated with a carrera fuel pump. Or with the carrera hard oil lines either for that matter. My guess is that at an owner at some point installed the green wire, possibly for a fuel pump.
Bill, I think the green wire is original. The unanswered question in my mind is what the holes in the inner fender were for. I am guessing an oil cooler, but it is just that, a guess.

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#7 Post by Bill Sargent » Mon Jan 17, 2022 2:19 am

Hi Dave - not sure what your inner fender holes were for but they were not for a factory carrera oil cooler installation. Neither the 1600 Carreras or carrera 2 ever had holes in the inner fender to oil lines or parts associated with the coolers. There were some holes for M8 bolts holding the oil cooler brackets on the 1600 Carreras but they are near the front of the battery box and would be 8mm.
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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#8 Post by Harlan Halsey » Mon Jan 17, 2022 5:24 am

I once asked Jim Wellington if the factory had ever installed a Carrera engine in a Convertible D, as I was toying with the idea of doing so. He said he thought there had been one. I suspect he was right, very few Convertible D's had Carrera engines. While it was common for Porsche to use a harness common to both Carreras and pushrod 356s having extra wires in pushrod cars, I doubt that D Iteren would have put holes in the bodywork to accommodate Carrera wiring in all Convertible Ds. (I solved my issue simply by acquiring the rest of a Carrera for $4000. Things were cheaper then.)

Putting a fuel pump in the place the Carrers pumps were located (bracketed to the torsion bar tubes) is a neat way to add an electric pump these days. But it is a non-trivial plumbing job, and the cover must be removable for access. (BTW the original Autopulse fuel pumps are heavy, prime poorly, tend to leak, require points adjustment, and were rather unreliable. That's probably why there were two of them. And why Porsche went to a single Bendix pump in the tire well in the Bs)

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#9 Post by Scott Schneider » Sun Feb 13, 2022 9:37 pm

Harlan, et all,

I have a letter from Porsche that states "We can inform you that only three Convertible D vehicles had 4 cam engines installed. One was a right hand drive car and was used by the Development Department."

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#10 Post by Brad Ripley » Mon Feb 14, 2022 12:35 am

About 4-cams in Conv D and Roadsters, see page 399, 4 cam book, Spsrenger and & Heinrichs. -- two Conv D and three in Rdstr.

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#11 Post by Harlan Halsey » Mon Feb 14, 2022 4:28 am

Another case of "rare" because it was a poor idea.

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#12 Post by Mike Smith » Fri Feb 18, 2022 5:54 pm

#9 Post by Scott Schneider » Sun Feb 13, 2022 9:37 pm
Harlan, et all,

I have a letter from Porsche that states "We can inform you that only three Convertible D vehicles had 4 cam engines installed.
One was a right hand drive car and was used by the Development Department."
It does not appear to have been sold with its 4 – Cam

The Kardex says Engine No. 69 080
Mike Smith (Essex - UK)

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#13 Post by DaveErickson » Sun Mar 27, 2022 10:02 pm

Another pair of questions related to Carrera features in a 59 Convertible D: the D has an M8 weld nut on the left wall of the engine compartment, just in front of the carb. pre-heat air horn. I assume that is for mounting some Carrera component. Is that correct? Also, the inner rear wall of the engine compartment has two holes about 30mm -40mm dia. (eyeball measurement), on upper right and upper left sides. What are those for, and are plugs available since they are the perfect mouse hole?

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#14 Post by Harlan Halsey » Mon Mar 28, 2022 4:21 am

Dave,
I think is safe to say that there were no Carrera special elements in your car, except possibly an extra wire in the loom for the second coil. 1956 T1s had all the Carrera features except a couple of extra holes in the dashboard for the coil switches and a couple of holes for the fuel lines in the front of the tunnel. The Carrera features were eliminated in the 57 T2s and subsequent cars unless they were specifically Carreras. I have a '58 Convertible D, the 19th one made, still in original condition, which lacks Carrera features.
Many 356s had modifications of varying quality as the years passed and the cars passed into junk status. I don't think you can go wrong by repairing these things, but I think trying to associate oddities to Carrera functions is unproductive.
There are two holes in the engine compartment about the size you mention for access to the teardrop taillights. There are rubber plugs for these holes.

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Re: Carrera electric fuel pump in a 59 D?

#15 Post by DaveErickson » Wed Mar 30, 2022 12:39 pm

Harlan Halsey wrote:
Mon Mar 28, 2022 4:21 am
Dave,
I think is safe to say that there were no Carrera special elements in your car, except possibly an extra wire in the loom for the second coil. 1956 T1s had all the Carrera features except a couple of extra holes in the dashboard for the coil switches and a couple of holes for the fuel lines in the front of the tunnel. The Carrera features were eliminated in the 57 T2s and subsequent cars unless they were specifically Carreras. I have a '58 Convertible D, the 19th one made, still in original condition, which lacks Carrera features.
Many 356s had modifications of varying quality as the years passed and the cars passed into junk status. I don't think you can go wrong by repairing these things, but I think trying to associate oddities to Carrera functions is unproductive.
There are two holes in the engine compartment about the size you mention for access to the teardrop taillights. There are rubber plugs for these holes.
Harlan, thanks that is the information I was looking for. Prior to asking I searched all the engine compartment body panels and interior body parts on Stoddard. I did not see any rear engine compartment panels with holes, and I could not locate any rubber plugs except this one, for B&C: NLA-025-120-20 Rear Reflector Hole Plug for 356B and 356C 64402512020 NLA02512020.
rubber plug.jpg


Is that the correct plug?

What about the weld nut on the left side of the engine compartment, what is that for? It is not a user mod, appears original.

Also, in addition to the Carrera wire for a second coil, there are three additional carrera wires in the harness: the green wire for the carrera fuel pump in the front, and a pair of jumpers for the carrera kill switch.

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