Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

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Rex Vandenberg
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Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#1 Post by Rex Vandenberg » Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:00 am

Just wondering if anyone could help identify the correct gear selector parts for my 1955 pre-a.
I have been given a bunch of parts with the Car I am putting together , and I am sorting out what is correct for vehicle.
1/- I have 3 different gear selector rod retaining hats, all different , first one is taller , and has a welded ring at the top (see pics)
2/- I also have 3 different reverse lockout plates. (see pics) (number 2 looks like the parts manual
3/- I have 2 different springs
4/- and Finally I have one mounting bracket , but this does not look like a 356 Pre-A ( looking in parts manual.)
Thinking I might just cut of Switch mount , as the Pre-A has the switch mount in the Tunnel.

Thanks in advance...
Attachments
Gear shifter lockout.JPG
Gear shifter lockout.JPG (49.01 KiB) Viewed 1368 times
Gear shifter hats.JPG
Gear shifter hats.JPG (46.8 KiB) Viewed 1368 times

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Spencer Harris
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#2 Post by Spencer Harris » Tue Oct 05, 2021 1:07 pm

Rex Vandenberg wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:00 am
1/- I have 3 different gear selector rod retaining hats, all different , first one is taller , and has a welded ring at the top (see pics)
2/- I also have 3 different reverse lockout plates. (see pics) (number 2 looks like the parts manual
3/- I have 2 different springs
4/- and Finally I have one mounting bracket , but this does not look like a 356 Pre-A ( looking in parts manual.)
Thinking I might just cut of Switch mount , as the Pre-A has the switch mount in the Tunnel.
I believe that retaining hat no. 1 is correct. Either no. 1 or no. 2 lockout plate - maybe either would work. The first spring pictured. Check that it fits with the spring cap. Correct, the mounting bracket is for a later car. Your solution of cutting off the switch mount bracket will likely work OK. I didn't photograph my '53 assembly before installing, but here are a few pics that may help, some of which you may already have.

53 assembly installed
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Christer Rye photo
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56 shop manual
56 Shop Manual R49.JPG
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55 parts manual
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53 parts manual
53 Parts Manual illus IX.JPG
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Spencer Harris
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Rex Vandenberg
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#3 Post by Rex Vandenberg » Wed Oct 06, 2021 6:20 am

Thanks Spencer for your information which is very helpful.
I am yet to find a spring guide/hat, I cant seem to find them new (356241260), so will have to find a second hand one...
I dont think early VW beetle had spring guide/hat , does any one know ?

Thanks again Spencer

Rex

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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#4 Post by Rex Vandenberg » Wed Oct 06, 2021 6:49 am

OK, Bit my research,
Looks like Stoddard have the spring hat/retainer under a different number.
Instead of
35624126 ,they have
35641126

https://www.stoddard.com/35641126.html

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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#5 Post by Tony Proasi » Wed Oct 06, 2021 7:44 am

Rex,

VW did use the hat and spring. The tall version is the same as a VW split window bus.

Tony

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Spencer Harris
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#6 Post by Spencer Harris » Wed Oct 06, 2021 12:57 pm

Rex Vandenberg wrote:
Wed Oct 06, 2021 6:49 am
OK, Bit my research,
Looks like Stoddard have the spring hat/retainer under a different number.
Instead of
35624126 ,they have
35641126

https://www.stoddard.com/35641126.html
That sure looks like the correct part; possibly just a typo error.
The only other spring cap that I see on the Stoddard site is the later version for 356B models (695-424-135-00).
Spencer Harris
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#7 Post by Spencer Harris » Thu Oct 07, 2021 12:42 am

Rex Vandenberg wrote:
Tue Oct 05, 2021 7:00 am
Thinking I might just cut of Switch mount , as the Pre-A has the switch mount in the Tunnel.
Rex,
I forgot that I had this mounting plate and lockout plate from '55 coupe 53070. The lockout plate is worn, but appears to match your photo #2 in shape. Here are some pics and measurements that may make you feel more comfortable cutting the backup switch mount off the later bracket you have. OD measurements and ctr to ctr hole positions measure the same as my '58 cab. You can see that the fixed switch mount was simply welded onto the older plates. Five minutes with a cutoff wheel and you're in business.
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Rex Vandenberg
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#8 Post by Rex Vandenberg » Sun Oct 10, 2021 6:24 am

Thanks Spencer,
yes my 356A bracket measures the same, so I will just cut off the reverse light switch bracket so it will suit my 1955 pre-A . However I need to find a reverse light switch to replace the missing Bosch type that fits in the mounting bracket welded inside the tunnel. I have not found a supplier yet, so I might have to use a 356A switch , and leave the bracket on the shift plate !

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Spencer Harris
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#9 Post by Spencer Harris » Sun Oct 10, 2021 12:04 pm

Rex Vandenberg wrote:
Sun Oct 10, 2021 6:24 am
I need to find a reverse light switch to replace the missing Bosch type that fits in the mounting bracket welded inside the tunnel. I have not found a supplier yet, so I might have to use a 356A switch , and leave the bracket on the shift plate !
They're pretty much the same switch as the push-button starter switch. You can find inexpensive ones ($50 or so) on the Samba site. That said, the 356A bracket and switch was a good upgrade. Original floor-mounted brackets were flimsy and prone to breaking. My original '53 bracket was 2mm thick and I used 2.4mm steel to fabricate the replacement.
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CIMG9042 (Large).JPG
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Martin Langer
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#10 Post by Martin Langer » Tue May 31, 2022 7:03 am

Based on the parts shown in the original question, I have a question on the dimensions: My problem is, the lock plate does not block the shift stick. The nose for reverse lock of the shift stick is always approx. 2mm lower than the lock plate, even when not pushed down.

The attached picture shows my parts.
download/file.php?mode=view&id=94076

Also shown is the gap between the lock plate and the nose for reverse lock.
download/file.php?mode=view&id=94077
download/file.php?mode=view&id=94078

The dimensions are:
Allover height of hat / ball housing: 55mm
Distance on stick between center of ball and center of hole for shift rod pin: 69mm
Distance on stick between top of nose for reverse lock and center hole for shift rod pin: 23mm.

In case my assembly is correct, I see 3 options for getting the reverse lock to function.
1. Weld approx. 5mm of material to the vertical part of the existing lock plate
2. Make a new lock plate with the vertical piece extending 5mm further down.
3. Adding a 5mm plate under the hat / ball housing - with a cutout for the lock plate - to get the shift stick higher.

Any other thoughts from the experts, please?

Martin
Attachments
Shift lever gap with locking plate 2.jpg
Shift lever gap with locking plate 1.jpg
Shift lever assembly of parts.jpg

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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#11 Post by Spencer Harris » Tue May 31, 2022 10:43 pm

Hi Martin,
All my sticks are installed, so I cannot measure one for comparison. I believe the shift sticks changed with the T1 and introduction of the 644 gearboxes, but I don't know the specifics. I was hoping Vic Skirmants would see your post and reply, as he likely knows the answer. Before welding on the lock plate or making a new one, try adding a couple of washers between the ball housing and the plate it rests on to make sure the lockout will work. It may look OK with the washers and save you some effort.
Send a PM to Vic and ask him to look at your post and respond. Good luck, and please post your solution when you figure it out.
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James Davies
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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#12 Post by James Davies » Wed Jun 01, 2022 4:37 am

Martin, it looks like your car has the 1954-55 shifter. And it looks like Porsche introduced that early. Lucky you! Introduced around coupe ~51960. All the 52xxx cars have it. Can't help you with the parts. I only note that everything you've shown in your picture looks correct, though clearly it sits too low relative to the lock-out.

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Re: Whats the correct shifter parts for 356 Pre-A

#13 Post by Martin Langer » Fri Jun 10, 2022 1:58 pm

Thank you Spencer and James for your input! Also, thank you Vic for the PM correspondence!
With your confirmation, that I have the correct parts, I decided on welding approx. 5mm material on top of my #1 design locking plate. The attached photo shows the raw part. A brief trial installation worked well. I must still grind off the front and rear corners of the lock plate to match the curve of the nose of the shift stick and give it all a finish touch. Then it is time to move on to the next issue, which is already waiting ...
Martin.
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20220610_180820.jpg

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