911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

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Marc Walz
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911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#1 Post by Marc Walz » Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:44 pm

Hello,

my name is Marc from Heidelberg, Germany. I‘m new in the club and in this forum. Beside a few early 911 I just added a 1960 356 T5 to my collection. The car is originally from Arizona, has still it‘s first original paint and was never welded. My plans are to keep the car as it is, but restore the complete technic as engine, gearbox, suspension etc. I will slam the car with some VW drop-spindles to give it the special Outlaw look 8)

Below I have attached a pic at the day when I bought it at a Porsche dealer in Northern Germany.

Here‘s my question: I want to rebuild the engine and upgrade it to 1700/1800cc. I also want to use a 911-style fan, but couldn‘t find a manufacturer who offer a kit for the 356 engine. I found plenty of dealers who sell kits for VW Type1- and Type4 engines,but not for the 356 or the 912. Do you guys have any suggestions?

Thanx in advance
Marc
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Greg Bryan
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#2 Post by Greg Bryan » Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:33 am

I have never seen a 911-style cooling setup for the 616 engine.
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#3 Post by Martin Benade » Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:46 am

It looks like you got a rock-solid car there. Enjoy it! As for the 911 fan, it would look “cool” but actually knowing if the conversion was well engineered wouldn’t be that easy. Maybe you should drive it in stock form for a while. You might decide to leave well enough alone, as my father often recommended.
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#4 Post by Michael Branning » Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:31 pm

Martin Benade wrote:
Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:46 am
It looks like you got a rock-solid car there. Enjoy it! As for the 911 fan, it would look “cool” but actually knowing if the conversion was well engineered wouldn’t be that easy. Maybe you should drive it in stock form for a while. You might decide to leave well enough alone, as my father often recommended.
Welcome to the Club and the Forum, we are happy to see you here. There is a certain charm to a stock 356, driving a slow car fast can be rewarding at speeds that are not illegal. Since you have the budget for multiple cars, if you still want a souped up 356, perhaps you keep this one stock and add a well developed outlaw ….perhaps even an Emory? Of course, its your car to use as you see fit, its just that it’s pretty special given original paint and being unrestored…which leads some of us to recommend conserving it’s originality.
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#5 Post by Marc Walz » Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:30 pm

Thanx guys for your kind words. Looks like I have to rebuild the engine without the 911-style fan, at least for the moment. Today I got a response of my email which I sent last week to Bernie Bergmann in which I asked him if his 911-style fan kits for VW engines will fit the 356 engines as well. He mentioned that they will not fit, but he is already working on a solution for 356/912 engines, but that will still takes a few more month.

So once again, thanx for your help.

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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#6 Post by Justin Rio » Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:10 pm

Marc, Contact my Buddy Mark Van Deventor At 356West. He built a 911 fan conversion "kit" for 356/912 motors back in the 90's. I've seen his old original mold for the fiberglass shroud still lying about his shop so I am certain he could put something together for you. Here is his contact: info356WEST@gmail.com Best of luck with your project. Justin

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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#7 Post by Greg Bryan » Sun Jul 31, 2022 10:05 pm

I don’t think you can run the stock oil cooler with the 911 style fan on a VW T1 motor and must use a remote cooler. Maybe that’s not important to you, but I don’t like that idea.
I suppose a Carrera cooling system can be installed -
I think there are some people making a 4-cam style fan housing for the 616 motor
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#8 Post by Justin Rio » Mon Aug 01, 2022 1:25 pm

Yes, you've got to convert to a remote cooler set up. The new 4-cam housing requires welding and permanent changes to the top of the block where the 911 kit I've seen is reversable. Also, he can put a 911 system together for his motor in the 2,500.00+or- range where the 4-cam unit is going to be well north of 10K just for the components.

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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#9 Post by Greg Bryan » Mon Aug 01, 2022 2:29 pm

Oh yeah - you’ve jogged my memory on the machining and welding on that faux-cam setup and you would only want to do it on a spare block for sure - it looks cool though. Can’t remember who was doing that - Bill Sargent maybe …
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#10 Post by Craig Richter » Tue Aug 02, 2022 11:42 am

Over the years, I have seen SO many modifications done "just because I could", and most of them: cost A LOT of money, RUINED the 356's value, RUINED the 356's handling, and were just silly ideas run amuck. Real professionals like Emory do produce amazing vehicles if you want a proper one-of-a-kind, but listen to Michael and enjoy the considerable charm of just driving a proper 356. Then, maybe add a little power, but don't go nuts.
 

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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#11 Post by Mike Smith » Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:14 am

By: Craig Richter on Tue Aug 02, 2022 5:42 pm
Over the years, I have seen SO many modifications done "just because I could", and most of them: cost A LOT of money, RUINED the 356's value, RUINED the 356's handling, and were just silly ideas run amuck. Real professionals like Emory do produce amazing vehicles if you want a proper one-of-a-kind, but listen to Michael and enjoy the considerable charm of just driving a proper 356. Then, maybe add a little power, but don't go nuts.

PLUS 1 - Craig
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#12 Post by Vic Skirmants » Wed Aug 03, 2022 7:33 am

Plus 10, Craig!

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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#13 Post by C J Murray » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:18 am

Of course I agree with Craig. I will add another reason that supports his opinion. The Porsche 356 was created with the fundamental consideration of being simple and therefore light weight and efficient. Anything that you do to the car that adds complexity or weight to a 356 is at odds with what made it the iconic giant killer that brought the cars so much popularity. It is your car and you can do whatever makes you happy but I strongly advise you to spend a considerable amount of time driving the car in its stock form. If you haven't spent time driving a 356 you have no idea why the owners love these cars. Anything you do to the suspension will ruin the car for street use. Adding a bling cooling system will add nothing to the function of the engine. If you had owned a few 356s and wanted to modify one I would be against it(for me) but you would be making an informed decision. If you modify your 356 without really knowing why a stock one is special then you are making a mistake. Drive it stock for long enough to understand what it is. If possible also have another 356 owner drive it to confirm that your car is functioning as it should. They can drive very poorly after years of neglect.
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#14 Post by Mike Smith » Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:44 am


Plus 1 - CJ
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Re: 911-Style fan for 356 engine + Introduction

#15 Post by Marc Walz » Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:34 pm

Thanx gents for your opinions and advise. I will not try to fix a 911 style fan to my 356 engine, your mentioned points are right, thank you for that. As already described in another thread I‘ll keep the engine almost stock, except 1720 big bore kit, „Maestro“ cam (actually a current Elgin cam but similar to the Maestro cam) and 912 heads. I also ordered a 123 ignition system for less maintenance.

But I still will modify the suspension :) Just a bit lower with some drop spindles, nothing radical, just to lower the COG to increase handling and make the car more „sportive“.

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