Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

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Jules Dielen
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#31 Post by Jules Dielen »

The NOS was for the D, the SC got a very good used one since I was not going to install another Dansk (hopefully the Leistritz will last long enough!)
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David Jones
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#32 Post by David Jones »

Karman Konnection in UK has a used 356a muffler on offer for 450 pounds if anyone is interested.
If I had known I would live this long I would have pushed the envelope a little harder.
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Jim Nelson
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#33 Post by Jim Nelson »

You can occasionally find a NOS Leisritz on German EBay….

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Thomas Sottile
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#34 Post by Thomas Sottile »

I think we must be brain dead why are we still buy the piece of junk maybe we like the challenge

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Bill Sargent
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#35 Post by Bill Sargent »

A 356 B/C muffler installed in a 356 A will foul the carrera engine tray located below the bolt in pushrod tray. As Harlan noted you can bash in the upper corners and get it to fit. If you do somehow get a B/C muffler installed on an A without bashing the corners it will wear away parts of the carrera engine tray - with the accompanying ugly noises.
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Mark Sabbann
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#36 Post by Mark Sabbann »

Mark Roth wrote: Sat Jul 23, 2022 3:19 pm Al Zim is on vacation from posting until October 6. He has asked me to post the following on his behalf:

The following situations will cause the muffler not to fit in the engine.
1: The case has been fly cut and line bored. Now the heads are closer together.
2: The heads have been resurfaced: Now the heads are closer together.
3: the compression ratio has been altered with the use of more than one thin shim. Now the heads are further apart.
4. Compression is further reduced with the “Porsche” thick one MM gaskets. Pushing the heads further apart.
5. Cylinder height is not at factory specifications. It could be wider or narrower. Neither will fit the muffler.
6: The exhaust pipes from cylinder 1 and 3 do not fit because the heads are closer together…causing a misfit in the muffler.
7. The production design of the three (3) piece case was completed about 68 years ago. Obviously things were different then. So were the specifications and manufacturing procedures..
8. The worst part of this equation is that everyone thinks that these are simple engines! They are not.
After purchasing the B/C muffler from Zim's, where the catalog information says nothing about this muffler being a Dansk, and having it not fit, I beg to differ in most of those cases provided by Zim's. With regard to each and my C engine:
1: N/A
2: N/A A few thousandths fly cut shouldn't be enough for misalignment.
3: N/A very close to stock CR
4: N/A very close to stock CR
5: ??
6: N/A stock spacing
7: So why do Dansk mufflers not fit? They probably have some smart engineers on board but they cant' figure this out in 68 years?
8: What's the point here?

The problem with my muffler is none of these. It is not a lateral, side-to-side manifold bolt spacing issue as implied by all of the line items from Zim's. It is as I have seen others make reference to, the vertical locations of the #1 and #3 J-tube connection pipes on the Dansk muffler. It has nothing to do with cylinder spacing or height. They are too high on the muffler body which leads to higher J-pipe positions which then interfere with the heater boxes. And therefore they require modifications.

But the big question is why does Zim's still sell these mufflers, given that they know the problems, are even willing to identify them, and Zim's wants to be a respected vendor to the 356 community? I waited too long after purchase to attempt the installation and now have gone past the return window of time with Zim's so I am stuck with a muffler that must be modified for installation. It may look nice but the devil is in the details.

I have left similar complaints with the Zim's online contact form, with no response. And of course, once you start to try to fit the muffler, and it doesn't fit without a struggle, inevitably there will be some paint removal, and how does that work with a 'must be returned in resalable condition.' policy requirement?
Mark Sabbann
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David Jones
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#37 Post by David Jones »

Mark, I have to chuckle at the last self defeating comment or perhaps caveat by Zim's. "Must be returned in resalable condition" I guess by the letter of the law even if you cut and welded it it is still in "resaleable" condition, just questionable as to whether anyone would buy it. Should be in "useable condition" which would make it ineligible for sale initially. So much to argue over here, bottom line is that neither Zim's or anyone else should be selling these mufflers without the caveat that like IKEA, " some assembly may be required" and also possibly some disassembly before use.
I wonder if a letter to Dansk from the registry would bring results?
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Mark Sabbann
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#38 Post by Mark Sabbann »

David Jones wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:07 am Mark, I have to chuckle at the last self defeating comment or perhaps caveat by Zim's. "Must be returned in resalable condition" I guess by the letter of the law even if you cut and welded it it is still in "resaleable" condition, just questionable as to whether anyone would buy it. Should be in "useable condition" which would make it ineligible for sale initially. So much to argue over here, bottom line is that neither Zim's or anyone else should be selling these mufflers without the caveat that like IKEA, " some assembly may be required" and also possibly some disassembly before use.
I wonder if a letter to Dansk from the registry would bring results?
Thanks David. Maybe someone has attempted to contact Dansk in the past, I don't know for sure. I just now left a note in the Contact Form for JP Group, the parent company of Dansk. I'll certainly share any response I get.
Mark Sabbann
1964 SC Coupe 'Essy'
1965 C Coupe 'The Yellow Delicious'

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Brian R Adams
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#39 Post by Brian R Adams »

David Jones wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:07 am Mark, I have to chuckle at the last self defeating comment or perhaps caveat by Zim's. "Must be returned in resalable condition"
Is he still on vacation? Popcorn ready here for when we're graced by an appearance and response.
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Mark Sabbann
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#40 Post by Mark Sabbann »

My paraphrased version of the statement should be replaced with correct Returns wording from Zim's:

"New Parts: All returned parts must be in saleable condition. The part must never have been installed, must be in the original packaging, and must be in good clean condition with no markings, handwriting, grease or dirt."

So this basically makes the part un-installable, without modification. The design by Dansk won't fit. It takes at least a partial installation attempt to test the fit, finding that it doesn't and coming away with some wear and tear, paint loss etc. So installing it without modifications but affecting the paint is impossible and then that nullifies the return policy for no markings. If you don't modify it, and you can't return it, now you are stuck with a new boat anchor that strangely resembles a 356 muffler.
Mark Sabbann
1964 SC Coupe 'Essy'
1965 C Coupe 'The Yellow Delicious'

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Mike Wilson
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#41 Post by Mike Wilson »

I have to ask...it is pretty well known that Dansk mufflers are crap. They don't fit and develop cracks and holes. So, why do our vendors still sell them knowing this and risk their reputations on selling a crappy part? If our vendors will stop ordering them and let Dansk know why, maybe Dansk will finally take notice and take corrective action. As long as they continue to be bought, Dansk will not be forced make any changes. Yes, I know they are less expensive than other mufflers available but are they worth the grief?

Mike
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Jon Schmid
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#42 Post by Jon Schmid »

Mike Wilson wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 6:32 pm I have to ask...it is pretty well known that Dansk mufflers are crap. They don't fit and develop cracks and holes. So, why do our vendors still sell them knowing this and risk their reputations on selling a crappy part? If our vendors will stop ordering them and let Dansk know why, maybe Dansk will finally take notice and take corrective action. As long as they continue to be bought, Dansk will not be forced make any changes. Yes, I know they are less expensive than other mufflers available but are they worth the grief?

Mike
Hi Mike: My short answer: "no." :x

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Mike Wilson
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#43 Post by Mike Wilson »

Hi, Jon. I think that comes under the category of "ask me how I know!".

All the best,

Mike
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Jon Schmid
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#44 Post by Jon Schmid »

Mike Wilson wrote: Wed Aug 10, 2022 8:40 pm Hi, Jon. I think that comes under the category of "ask me how I know!".

All the best,

Mike
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Re: Problems with Dansk 356A Muffler

#45 Post by Dave Erickson »

Mark, I think the problem you ran into is the same one I ran into, just your analysis was better. In the end I fixed my muffler by cutting the welded gussets for the bottom 1&3 pipes so I could bend them down into alignment. After doing that and rewelding the gussets, the muffler slipped on/off easily.

Mike, unfortunately for "A" owners, Dansk is the only game in town. Nobody else makes reproduction 356A mufflers. If the Registry would be willing to contact Eisenmann and request that they make the full set of 356 mufflers, I would be all for a boycott of Dansk.

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