On headlight lenses....

356 Porsche-related discussions and questions.
Post Reply
Message
Author
User avatar
Eric Cherneff
356 Fan
Posts: 724
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:32 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

headlight lens

#1 Post by Eric Cherneff »

What is the correct headlight lens for a 1961? I researched here and on the Samba, and understand it should NOT have "SB19 SB20 SB21" on it (1963? and later), and would likely be made by Hella.

The equivalent VW part at the time had a VW logo and "E1.0671.01" across bottom, Hella at the top, and "25484" in lower left corner.

Did Porsche use the same one, or did they have one without the VW logo on it?

The Hella assemblies that were on the car when I bought it 2 years ago are date stamped for late 1960 which is correct for the car. However, one lens has SB19 etc. on it, and the other is completely devoid of markings, so I assume it is repro.
Eric Cherneff
1966 912

356 Registry database manager

Jan Kolm
356 Fan
Posts: 600
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:35 am
Location: Colorado

Re: headlight lens

#2 Post by Jan Kolm »

The correct Hella sealed-beam lens has a large Hella logo at the bottom and two rows of data that follow the curved bottom of the lens. These were produced from ~1958 until late 1963 and are correct for adssemblies with adjusting screws at the 5 and 7 o'clock positions.
Jan Kolm
356 Registry #1066
1960 1600N Coupe

User avatar
Eric Cherneff
356 Fan
Posts: 724
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:32 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Re: headlight lens

#3 Post by Eric Cherneff »

Thanks Jan - one point of clarification - they do not have VW logos on them?
Eric Cherneff
1966 912

356 Registry database manager

User avatar
Jim Breazeale
Classifieds Monitor
Posts: 2802
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 8:07 pm
Tag: SF Giants Fan
Location: SF Bay Area
Contact:

Re: headlight lens

#4 Post by Jim Breazeale »

Here is a picture of an unrestored headlight. According to Paul's data it was made in the 3rd week of January 1961.
Attachments
IMG_0601.jpg
IMG_0600.jpg
Jim Breazeale
www.easypor.com
www.facebook.com/pages/European-Auto-Salvage-Yard-EASY/120458108029410

User avatar
Eric Cherneff
356 Fan
Posts: 724
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 9:32 pm
Location: Victoria, BC

Re: headlight lens

#5 Post by Eric Cherneff »

Thanks Jim, very helpful. You wouldn't have a really nice pair of lens like this available do you? Please contact me offline if you do.
Eric Cherneff
1966 912

356 Registry database manager

Jan Kolm
356 Fan
Posts: 600
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:35 am
Location: Colorado

Re: headlight lens

#6 Post by Jan Kolm »

Jim Breazeale wrote:... According to Paul's data it was made in the 3rd week of January 1961.
I did the Hella date code research and posted it on the Samba. Paul simply pulled it from there and included it in his article. He just couldn't assign credit for it because I posted it anonomously. At the time i finished the research (~2000), nobody on the 356Talk forum, other than Brad Ripley and I, had much of an interest in deciphering date codes. The VW Barndoor Bus community, on the other hand, had an extreme interest, so that's where they ended up.

Part numbers for the late T-2/356B clear lenses are -3-60370 and 4-60370. There may be others. Correct lenses have no VW logos on them.
Jan Kolm
356 Registry #1066
1960 1600N Coupe

User avatar
Joris Koning
356 Fan
Posts: 2505
Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2008 12:38 pm
Location: Netherlands

Re: headlight lens

#7 Post by Joris Koning »

Jan,

Thank you very much for the great research you did. I believe back in 2000 there were also other people interested in this kind of research. They might not have been aware of your work.

Joris
'56 Coupe
'57 Coupe
'59 Cab 
'60 Coupe

User avatar
Bob DiCorpo
356 Fan
Posts: 368
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:11 pm
Location: Massachusetts

Re: headlight lens

#8 Post by Bob DiCorpo »

Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob
Bob DiCorpo
'56 Speedster
Massachusetts 

Jan Kolm
356 Fan
Posts: 600
Joined: Wed Mar 26, 2008 1:35 am
Location: Colorado

Re: headlight lens

#9 Post by Jan Kolm »

Bob DiCorpo wrote:Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob
Bob,

The picture in Brett Johnson's authenticity books doesn't give a lot of detail, But I believe early 356A lenses have a small Hella logo at the bottom and (possibly) no numbers on the face of the lens. Very early 356A (1955 production) lenses may still have the "vestigial oval" in the center of the lens.

The part number (60370?) is cast into the backside of the lip at the top, along with the Hella name. A single digit number (2?) is cast into the lip at the bottom.
Jan Kolm
356 Registry #1066
1960 1600N Coupe

User avatar
roy mawbey
356 Fan
Posts: 795
Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:47 am
Location: SUNNY SUSSEX IN THE UK

Re: headlight lens

#10 Post by roy mawbey »

My 59 T2 "A" delivered into the UK in mid 59 still has the original headlight lenses. They are however Bosch headlights although original other lighting items on my car are Hella.

I presume? the Bosch headlights went onto cars delivered to Europe and Hella went to the USA? Mine are of course not sealed beam, more like candle beam :)

I attach 2 photos taken a while back
2010_0206headlamps0004.JPG
2010_0206headlamps0002.JPG
Roy
RHD356Asuper75 106954
ROY ALAN MAWBEY

User avatar
Chuck House
Registry Hall of Fame
Posts: 728
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:26 pm

Re: headlight lens

#11 Post by Chuck House »

Jan Kolm wrote:
Bob DiCorpo wrote:Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob
Bob,

The picture in Brett Johnson's authenticity books doesn't give a lot of detail, But I believe early 356A lenses have a small Hella logo at the bottom and (possibly) no numbers on the face of the lens. Very early 356A (1955 production) lenses may still have the "vestigial oval" in the center of the lens.

The part number (60370?) is cast into the backside of the lip at the top, along with the Hella name. A single digit number (2?) is cast into the lip at the bottom.
Here is an early 56 356A lens with the "vestigial oval".
Attachments
Sept 19 '05 115.jpg
Chuck House
Southern California

User avatar
Bob DiCorpo
356 Fan
Posts: 368
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 8:11 pm
Location: Massachusetts

Re: headlight lens

#12 Post by Bob DiCorpo »

Thank you Chuck and Jan. I've never seen this type of lens. They must be difficult to come by. Regards, Bob
Bob DiCorpo
'56 Speedster
Massachusetts 

User avatar
David Ramatowski
356 Fan
Posts: 406
Joined: Fri Jun 05, 2009 3:24 pm
Location: Northern VA, DC Metro

On headlight lenses....

#13 Post by David Ramatowski »

There is a quite a large number of variations in markings on headlight lenses. Some lettered on inside, some outside. Varying sizes of lettering. 1 or 2 characters being different. Etc., Etc. I know I have have run into a situation where I just can't seem to exactly match a lens to make a pair. If there is interest maybe a sticky thread could be started to assist people facing that issue. Pictures could be posted of lenses looking for their mates. Anyone think this merits a sticky?

User avatar
Sebastian Gaeta
356 Fan
Posts: 3047
Joined: Tue Mar 25, 2008 5:50 pm
Location: Ann Arbor, MI

Re: On headlight lenses....

#14 Post by Sebastian Gaeta »

I do. It is the really nit-picky stuff like this that keeps the cars correct for future generations who might just care about it. Many of us could not care any less about it, some a little too much :D

I'll start: AFAIK, the US spec lenses with the lettering on the inside are later reproductions. The period ones all have the raised "SB19 SB20 SB21" on the outside.
Sebastian Gaeta
www.arbormotion.com

Registry #8339

'65 C coupe
'64 C cab

-------
2014 Boxster 981
2005 997 C2 Cab
1967 Karmann Ghia Convertible
1966 VW Single Cab
1966 Ducati Cafe Racer
1964 Karmann Ghia Coupe
1963 Beetle

Etienne Kerkhoffs
356 Fan
Posts: 477
Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 3:05 pm

Re: On headlight lenses....

#15 Post by Etienne Kerkhoffs »

The lenses on my modelyear 59 T2 (built date Sep 1958) have the following marking:
180E 25-4-SB / 180E 25-4-SB2 / 180E 25-5-SB2 / 180E 25-51-SB2

180E 25-4-SB2 is also stamped on the headlight bucket (together with 29T which means 29th week of 1958, so probably original for my car).
hella2.jpg
hella2.jpg (32.13 KiB) Viewed 62660 times
PC122792.JPG
PC122792.JPG (31.67 KiB) Viewed 62660 times
PC122793.JPG
PC122793.JPG (35.63 KiB) Viewed 62660 times
Etienne Kerkhoffs
1958 356A T2 Sunroof Coupe

Post Reply