It is currently Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:57 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 31 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 5:44 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
More progress: the entire car is now in primer, all panels fitted.

Attachment:
IMG_3388 all In Promer.jpg
IMG_3388 all In Promer.jpg [ 344.26 KiB | Viewed 2232 times ]



At this point I think we can say that the car has been "saved". From here on its just the usual light restoration: Wiring, Suspension, Steering, etc. One thing I am going to do is fit the car for a B/C shifter. To do that I will use the B/C routing for the rear brake line. We have put the lower hole in the tunnel end where the brake line bracket was. I have a 741 transmission case sitting in the car now attached to the hoop. And right now i'm figuring out how to get the 741 front mounts to mate with the 644 chassis mounts.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Tue Jan 17, 2017 11:18 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
Well, installing the 741 turned out to be more involved than I had thought it might be. The front (nose) mount ears on the 741 are about 1/2" lower than they are on the 644:

Attachment:
IMG_3453 644 741 Mount Difference.jpg
IMG_3453 644 741 Mount Difference.jpg [ 494.32 KiB | Viewed 2177 times ]


Which meant that he shifter wouldn't quite clear the torsion bar tube. Luckily Bruce had a torsion bar tube center section which he had cut out of a '59, so I hole sawed the 741 hole and used it to see what was what:

Attachment:
IMG_3462 Fit to Car.jpg
IMG_3462 Fit to Car.jpg [ 467.54 KiB | Viewed 2177 times ]


As you can see the 644 shifter passes in the dented area of the tube and the 741 must pass beneath the full round section.The torsion tube is 3" in diameter but the space between the 644 and the 741 shifter bosses is about 2 3/4". I decided to move the 741 nose piece mounts up 7/8", 1/2" to put them in the right position vis a vis the 644 transmission mounts, and an additional 3/8" to clear the torsion tube. In the picture the 741 is in the desired position.

To accomplish this, I had Ron Chuck weld on aluminum extensions. He did a terrific job: perfect alignment, easy to machine and no voids:

Attachment:
IMG_3460 Machining Weldment.jpg
IMG_3460 Machining Weldment.jpg [ 518.23 KiB | Viewed 2177 times ]


This is how it came out.

Attachment:
IMG_3478 741 to 644 front Mount.jpg
IMG_3478 741 to 644 front Mount.jpg [ 570.29 KiB | Viewed 2177 times ]


We put the modified nose on the transmission case, and installed the transmission into the car. It went in easily, so now on to the next.


Last edited by Harlan Halsey on Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 6:51 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
Apparently the shift tube which runs from the transmission to the shifter is called the "Peace Pipe". I hadn't heard that one before. Clearly the shifter is early B because the shift lever has the roll pin and it's socket is slotted. But the one I have is not straight

Attachment:
IMG_3493 61 Peace Pipe.jpg
IMG_3493 61 Peace Pipe.jpg [ 434.18 KiB | Viewed 2131 times ]


The bend looks like it could be a factory bend, but is it? Or were they all straight?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Fri Jan 20, 2017 7:04 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:21 am
Posts: 3170
Location: Augusta,Michigan
Discussion of the 3 types of peace pipes.viewtopic.php?f=1&t=37659&p=227183&hilit=peace+pipe#p227183 2 for B and 1 for C cars. I have not had a car with the early B pipe but later B and C have no bend.

_________________
1965 356C There is never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2017 10:55 am 
356 Registry Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2009 5:02 pm
Posts: 6407
Location: SE Michigan
I think that bend on the early B pipe is factory. I can check when I get home Monday. Drop me an email if you want me to do that.

_________________


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 11:48 pm 
356 Fan

Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:06 pm
Posts: 1336
Location: Vista, CA
Harlan Halsey wrote:
Clearly the shifter is early B because the shift lever has the roll pin and it's socket is slotted. But the one I have is not straight
The bend looks like it could be a factory bend, but is it? Or were they all straight?

Harlan, that's a very early B tunnel rod.
Yes, they had a bend like that, assuming that the socket is still 90° to the length of the rod.

That rod should have an 18mm opening at the rear. If you use it, make sure that you have or purchase the correct coupler for it.
There's also an updated, stronger tunnel rod that will work with your early B shifter, which has 15mm opening at the rear.

_________________
Jon Bunin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 12:09 am 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:21 am
Posts: 3170
Location: Augusta,Michigan
If you do not have it the correct coupler will look like the one on the left. Photo is from an old post by Jon.


Attachments:
DSCN6196.JPG
DSCN6196.JPG [ 686.8 KiB | Viewed 2043 times ]

_________________
1965 356C There is never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over.
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 1:08 am 
356 Fan

Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2009 11:06 pm
Posts: 1336
Location: Vista, CA
Doug, there are aluminum-bodied replacements for all versions, so I wouldn't necessarily ID couplers by appearance.
I think it's best to ID couplers by shaft diameter.

_________________
Jon Bunin


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:01 am 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 8:21 am
Posts: 3170
Location: Augusta,Michigan
True Jon Here is the link that provides more info on peace pipes and couplers: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=37659&hilit=shift+coupler

_________________
1965 356C There is never enough time to do it right, but always enough time to do it over.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:46 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
Thank you for all the information. The tunnel was in the basket case '59 Carrera pictured at the left,along with the rest of the shifter. The rod was a bit dented which is partly why I'm not sure what the original configuration was. When I removed the dents and began straightening it, I was left with four what looked like factory dents. two either side of the bend, and the shifter socket is perpendicular to the long axis. The coupler looks like the one on the left above, and the interior diameter of the tunnel rod is a little under 18mm. I wasn't aware that there was a difference in diameters, thank you Jon.

These parts have been sitting on a shelf since 1977 and now is the time to put them to use.
My first Porsche was a 1962 B coupe which I drove to work for years, and sometimes towed the race car, a Lotus S7. That car was lost in a wreck and I replaced it with my '58 Convertible D in 1970 when I came to California. That's a great car but I always thought the shifter is a little crude. That impression was heightened when I got the Carrera which came with the A shifter as well as the early B. I put the Carrera back to 644 configuratiion. The Carerra always seemed to be hard to shift,compared to the D, and very hard to get into reverse. But it was a race car and it was what it was. It was only a year ago that, in conjunction thinking about this '56 that I decided to take a good look at the Carrera shifter. Two things came to light: first the Carrera shifter had been lengthened below the pivot. It was a short shifter! No wonder it took a little more effort to shift. and secondly the longer shifter hit the car bottom a little before it would move over to reverse! No wonder it was hard to get into reverse. Reverse was easy to remedy with a spacer under the shifter mounting. So the B shifter in the '56 may not be quite the big deal I thought it was going to be but it'll be fun to see, and the car can go either way.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sat Jul 01, 2017 8:31 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
One of the neat things about the 356 is the engineering which went into the parts. I refer here to the windshield wiper mechanism. There's nothing inherently difficult about attaching an electric motor to a crank and running wiper blades back and forth with it, except that it has run and then park the wipers in the same place each time the wipers are shut off. The "C" care have a relatively sophisticated system: variable speed. The control knob connection is all electrical and the motor uses dynamic braking. But that system didn't come about all at once. The 1956 T1 system is crude by comparison: single speed, friction braking and the on off control is by Bowden cable.

The unit on the '56 T1 was in need of some work: The gear boxes were frozen and the smoke had escaped out of the armature windings.

Attachment:
IMG_3441 Wiper Armature.jpg
IMG_3441 Wiper Armature.jpg [ 435.62 KiB | Viewed 1685 times ]


The armature is a bit unusual in that it has a brake band below the windings. I gave it to Palo Alto Electric to be rewound and they sent to to So Cal where after a couple of try's they finally got it right.

Attachment:
IMG_3444 Wiper Brake.jpg
IMG_3444 Wiper Brake.jpg [ 495.77 KiB | Viewed 1685 times ]


Here you can see the brake band attached to the start/stop lever.

In the following picture, you can see the wiper control. The control lever rides on a cam attached to the output shaft, a circle with a notch in it. In the picture the motor has stopped in the running position but the cable is in the stop position, because that's where the motor happened to stop when I disconnected the power. When I reconnect the power, the motor will run until the spring succeeds in pushing the lever into the notch. Then the points attached to the lever will open and the brake band will tighten on the armature. Pulling on the Bowden cable with the dash knob will pull the lever out of the notch closing the circuit, and releasing the brake band. As long as the knob is in the run position, the spring will be prevented from pushing the lever into the notch and opening the circuit. Volia! A single speed system with the park function. (In the later electrical control systems, the cam lifts a pin which opens a set of points, and the speed control is by a variable resistor in the field circuit.)

Attachment:
IMG_3439 Bowden Cable Connection.jpg
IMG_3439 Bowden Cable Connection.jpg [ 690.42 KiB | Viewed 1685 times ]


The gear boxes cleaned up nicely, the only problem was hardened grease with which they were packed. These early boxes can easily be bolted back together, and the push-rods have conventional steel ball and socket ends, not the molded in plastic sockets which the later systems use.

Attachment:
IMG_3451Wiper Gear Box Components.jpg
IMG_3451Wiper Gear Box Components.jpg [ 798.58 KiB | Viewed 1685 times ]


The one thing I am missing is one 8 mm x .75 mm threaded nut which goes behind the dash to clamp the Bowden cable end. Luckily the outer chrome bezel and the knob are there.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sat Dec 23, 2017 11:17 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
The '56 chassis is undercoated and ready for the color coat. We will choose one of the shades of silver to go with the blue interior.

Attachment:
IMG_3736 Ready for The Color Coat.jpg
IMG_3736 Ready for The Color Coat.jpg [ 309.88 KiB | Viewed 1126 times ]


There are a few small things yet to do before paint: for example, I decided to remove the star wheels from the hood hinges so that the hood cannot be easily kinked again. A hood prop will be required, but I feel that will be a small price to pay.

Attachment:
IMG_3731 Hood Hinge.jpg
IMG_3731 Hood Hinge.jpg [ 403.9 KiB | Viewed 1126 times ]


Removing the star wheel pivot is not trivial because the axle/bearing is larger than the hole in the side plate. The smaller tube is flared over the outside washer. When i tried to drill, the whole thing spun. The solution was to clamp a slightly larger drill in the vise, and set the bearing on it. That way the base drill tends to cut into the bearing tube and prevent it from turning while the bearing tube is drilled out.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:52 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
This week we had some good weather and Bruce painted the body. Big milestone. The 2 stage silver will get a few weeks of drying, depending on the weather, then rub out. The doors, hood, and deck lid were painted a couple of weeks ago and got a couple of days drying in the sun.

Attachment:
IMG_3743 56 Painted.jpg
IMG_3743 56 Painted.jpg [ 536.51 KiB | Viewed 804 times ]

The paint is a fine flake metallic silver, chosen both to look like the 50s Porsche color and to compliment the blue interior.
Attachment:
56 T1 In Paint I lowK.jpg
56 T1 In Paint I lowK.jpg [ 78.25 KiB | Viewed 748 times ]

And then final assembly: Wiring harness, brake lines, fuel line, shifter and the interior. We already have the complete new Autos interior. This is exciting progress.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 12:55 pm 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
One of the last pieces I need has been hard to find: the pivot bracket and U-bolt for the hand brake. Because the torsion bar tubes swell at the end, this clamp has about 1/4" larger clamp diameter than does the steering damper bracket. Vic Skirmants gave it to me! Thank you Vic.

This bracket shows one of the reasons I like working on 356 Porches: The pivot pin has 4 different diameters, where many manufacturers would get away with one or two, and a washer. The U-bolt is a forged part.

Attachment:
IMG_0087 '56 Hand B Painted and Plated.jpg
IMG_0087 '56 Hand B Painted and Plated.jpg [ 131.96 KiB | Viewed 519 times ]



I haven't seen the type of horns which came with the car. they are a little larger in diameter than the later Bosch horns which I am used to. You can tell by the bracktry and the yellow color that these horns were on the car.

Attachment:
IMG_0094 Horn As Was_8.jpg
IMG_0094 Horn As Was_8.jpg [ 108.97 KiB | Viewed 519 times ]

Attachment:
IMG_0093 56 Horn Front_4.jpg
IMG_0093 56 Horn Front_4.jpg [ 130.97 KiB | Viewed 519 times ]


And they lack the grille which the later horns have.

But amazingly, though I had to use the acetylene wrench to disassemble them they are cherry inside! It looks like clean-up, plating, painting, and new gasket will be all that is needed.

Attachment:
IMG_0092 56 Horn Inside_6.jpg
IMG_0092 56 Horn Inside_6.jpg [ 128.36 KiB | Viewed 519 times ]


A Talk Line search on "Horns" came up with the information that these are in fact the type that came on 1956 T1 cars. I just hadn't run across them before.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: WCSTA -06- 56 T1
PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:49 am 
356 Fan
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 2:05 pm
Posts: 159
The body has been polished out.

Attachment:
IMG_0105 56 Polished Out.jpg
IMG_0105 56 Polished Out.jpg [ 77.18 KiB | Viewed 458 times ]


And the interior and the underneath appropriately coated

Attachment:
IMG_0098 Front Trunk Textured.jpg
IMG_0098 Front Trunk Textured.jpg [ 91.41 KiB | Viewed 458 times ]


Attachment:
IMG_0100 Interior ready for Sound Deadner and Carpet.jpg
IMG_0100 Interior ready for Sound Deadner and Carpet.jpg [ 70.89 KiB | Viewed 458 times ]

Next week the car goes back on the rotisserie and we start installing the wiring and the brake lines.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 31 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Gordon White


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group