My 57 356A T1

[Mike N]

LED's are available for the beehive lenses. See here:

http://www.culayer.com/BA15S-HP.htm

Mike

[Mark Erbesfield]

Thanks for the lighting link. Any help with brakes would be appreciated.

[John Pepitone]

Mark,

I can shed some light on your brake questions....

"How do I know if the drums are usable and who can turn them?

Clean the flat inner surface of the drum, you should see a wear indicator dot for a general idea if they are worn heavily. You should also get a ID gauge to measure the minimal wear tolerance ( 280 mm). Do this in at least 6 areas to check if they are out of round. DO NOT take them to the local brake shop! They will grind them down way too much and you will need to have them re-lined.
I have read that I only want them turned minimally and somewhere I read to not turn them at all?

If they need turning have someone that knows these (356) drums do it.

How smooth do the wheel cylinder pistons need to be? Can they have tiny pits?
Minor tiny pits may be ok, but they need to be polished smooth so they dont scratch the cylinder walls, the pistons do not make the seal, the cups do. The stainless ones would be better.

In your picture of the rear drums, you are correct, sort of, what you refer to as a grease collector is actually an oil slinger, capturing any seapage from the bearing and keeping that lube out of the brake drum which would make stopping a bit of a challenge!

You may also want to contact Bill Brown, he has ads on the samba and the registry, well versed in rebuilding all brake components not to mention re sleeving the cylinders with stainless sleeves....he did mone.

Hope that helps

[Mark Erbesfield]

Mark,

I can shed some light on your brake questions....

"How do I know if the drums are usable and who can turn them?

Clean the flat inner surface of the drum, you should see a wear indicator dot for a general idea if they are worn heavily. You should also get a ID gauge to measure the minimal wear tolerance ( 280 mm). Do this in at least 6 areas to check if they are out of round. DO NOT take them to the local brake shop! They will grind them down way too much and you will need to have them re-lined.
I have read that I only want them turned minimally and somewhere I read to not turn them at all?

If they need turning have someone that knows these (356) drums do it.

How smooth do the wheel cylinder pistons need to be? Can they have tiny pits?
Minor tiny pits may be ok, but they need to be polished smooth so they dont scratch the cylinder walls, the pistons do not make the seal, the cups do. The stainless ones would be better.

In your picture of the rear drums, you are correct, sort of, what you refer to as a grease collector is actually an oil slinger, capturing any seapage from the bearing and keeping that lube out of the brake drum which would make stopping a bit of a challenge!

You may also want to contact Bill Brown, he has ads on the samba and the registry, well versed in rebuilding all brake components not to mention re sleeving the cylinders with stainless sleeves....he did mine.

Hope that helps

John, thanks for the help. My wheel cylinders look great so I will hone them and use new SS pistons. A few more questions.

How do I determine if my brake shoes are good? They are dated Sept, 1980 and I think they have not been used much. Should they be replaced out of principle due to age or only if they are worn? If worn, how to measure them?

What is it about the turning that needs to be done by someone who knows 356's? I have a friend who owns a machine shop who I am sure could turn them, but I need to tell him what he needs to be careful of.

One of my rear drums is missing the grease slinger. Do you know where I can get another?

Can old springs and parts be reused or should they be replaced 100%? I have a media blast cabinet so I can clean them up, but if they need to be replaced?

Thanks, Mark

[John Pepitone]

The brake shoes I would replace, rebuilt ones with new linings are cheap, about $60 for what stops your car, I wouldnt risk that. Yours may look ok but 30 year old bonding does not sound like something I would risk myself nor a restored car with. Same goes for the hardware kits, if they are just greasy, clean them up, rusty, throw them away, but usually not worth the trouble of restoring, replating, not to mention the springs loose integrity over 30-40 years. These complete kits are also cheap, like $30, all new, plated, ready to assemble.

With the drums, having an experienced person turn them, what I mean is, brake shops usually want to take off x amount of material, needed or not, they probably do not know the ID specification (280mm) etc, If you have a friend with a machine shop that is a good way to go, at least have him measure the ID, check for round, shave the surface if they look ok.


Not sure if any one is reproducing the slinger, but they do show up on ebay and the samba. If you see a junk drum for sale that has one, grab it, getting hard to find.

Hope that helps
John

[Mark Erbesfield]

The brake shoes I would replace, rebuilt ones with new linings are cheap, about $60 for what stops your car, I wouldnt risk that. Yours may look ok but 30 year old bonding does not sound like something I would risk myself nor a restored car with. Same goes for the hardware kits, if they are just greasy, clean them up, rusty, throw them away, but usually not worth the trouble of restoring, replating, not to mention the springs loose integrity over 30-40 years. These complete kits are also cheap, like $30, all new, plated, ready to assemble.

With the drums, having an experienced person turn them, what I mean is, brake shops usually want to take off x amount of material, needed or not, they probably do not know the ID specification (280mm) etc, If you have a friend with a machine shop that is a good way to go, at least have him measure the ID, check for round, shave the surface if they look ok.


Not sure if any one is reproducing the slinger, but they do show up on ebay and the samba. If you see a junk drum for sale that has one, grab it, getting hard to find.

Hope that helps
John

Ok, this is helping a bunch. New shoes it is. Next issue. A friend of mine pointed out that the hub center on my left rear drum may be too damaged for re-use. Here are pics, please give your opinions. He also suggested that maybe it could be turned and use a spacer, but not sure about that. Thanks

[Mark Erbesfield]

I thought I would update my progress with a link to the thread where I have been working on Media blasting.

http://porsche356registry.org/356talk/1 ... 33#p151433

I have also been working on blasting and painting the front suspension members in preparation for their return to the chassis. Received my new tie rod ends and bar from EASY today. Before I paint the suspension members, can anyone tell me if it matters whether paint gets inside where the bushings will be? I figure they will be reamed anyhow so it should not matter. Thanks for helping.

[Larry Coreth]

I would tape off the bushing bores for the trailing arms, C brackets and stub axle/ king pin bores otherwise it will be just harder to install them while trying to push out the extra paint. Now if you powder coat the parts it is vital for no paint to enter these bores as you will have to ream them out to install the bushings/king pin ! The powder coating is very hard and tenacious !

[Mark Erbesfield]

I will take the time to tape off the areas where I do not want paint. Next question, I was about to order suspension parts and noticed that Stoddard sells a kit with what appears to be bronze bushings vs. others sell the kit w steel bushings. What is correct? The price difference is about double. The ones that came out of my car were steel. Is it one is VW vs Porsche?

[Larry Coreth]

The originals were Brass but I have found the steel ones work fine if kept greased. Don't forget the whole front suspension is VW, with a couple modifications, note the VW symbols on the trailing arms, etc. The important difference are link pin seals.

[Mark Erbesfield]

The originals were Brass but I have found the steel ones work fine if kept greased. Don't forget the whole front suspension is VW, with a couple modifications, note the VW symbols on the trailing arms, etc. The important difference are link pin seals.

Yes I have noticed all the VW symbols. What do you mean by the link pin seals? Do all the kits come with these seals? I would think/hope that the bushings would be bronze vs. brass? I would also think that if you were driving these cars a lot bronze would be better, but as little as these cars are probably driven these days one or the other makes little difference as long as they are kept greased, as you mention.

[Larry Coreth]

Sorry, the bushings are bronze, a senior moment, which would mean they would wear and not the link pins but since today one usually replaces both the pins and the bushings so it is almost a moot point. No, all link pin kits will not give you the right seals. The correct ones are peculiar to Porsche 356. See page S-15 of your factory shop manual.

[Mark Erbesfield]

I will order the kit from NLA since they have the bronze bushings. I had wondered about whether I actually needed the link pins themselves bc mine look to be very good and figured you could order new bushings alone and then ream the new bushings to fit your existing pins. Not sure it is worth the effort. But I think you have to ream the new bushings regardless whether you get new pins or not?

[Larry Coreth]

No the link pin bushings rarely need reaming, the fit is not that tight. The king pin bushings do however require reaming to suit, see factory shop manual pages S-17 to S-20. Also I suggest you look at the "Summary of Tolerances and Wear Limits" section in the end of the "Steering and Front Axle" chapter of the shop manual too !
The Most of your questions will be answered by the shop manual and some you may not have thought of yet.

[Mark Erbesfield]

No the link pin bushings rarely need reaming, the fit is not that tight. The king pin bushings do however require reaming to suit, see factory shop manual pages S-17 to S-20. Also I suggest you look at the "Summary of Tolerances and Wear Limits" section in the end of the "Steering and Front Axle" chapter of the shop manual too !
The Most of your questions will be answered by the shop manual and some you may not have thought of yet.

I need to get a shop manual. Where is a good place to get one? I saw the one for BC cars on PDF, but mine is an A.

Edit, if link pins do not wear much I would suspect mine ok as the car has not rolled in 30 years and they felt tight to me.