Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there?

For those who couldn't care less how their 356 left the factory!
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David Witkowski
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Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there?

#1 Post by David Witkowski »

Is this something anyone would want to do?

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Steve Proctor
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#2 Post by Steve Proctor »

Absolutely.
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Miguel Antonetti
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#3 Post by Miguel Antonetti »

Frequently done, even 930 engines inplants...

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C J Murray
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#4 Post by C J Murray »

You do not want to drive a race 356 on the street. You would be very unhappy with the performance.
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mario musto
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#5 Post by mario musto »

Dave- email sent

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Ashley Page
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#6 Post by Ashley Page »

Are you referring to suspension or engine / transaxle or both?

I have done some of those mods to suspension but left the front axle or spindle stock ( did not use a drop spindle). I think the car handles better than before - primarely due to shocks, front sway bar, rear camber regulator, ride height, tires and alignment. I put together an adjustable front bar which I have never adjusted. Never tried changing the camber regulator or adding the second leaf. Several folks that have driven it, including raceing drivers, have said it handles well - for a 356. I put metric heims and machined new links for the regulator and the front bar has heims for zeroing the bar and it has adjustment for stiffness. Also boxed the front trailing arms with formed sheet metal ( not angle iron :) )

I have a car set of Brembo F-3 (small size) aluminum 4 piston racing calipers with piston sizes of the same front / rear ratio as stock but have not put them on the car and at this point probably won't. The stock disc brakes, with good pads and rotors, stainless braded Teflon hoses and a new master, stop extremely well. Besides, I am sure the stock iron calipers are stiffer than the aluminum ones which contributes to the great pedal feel.

Main reason for any of this - for fun as it's a hobby. Enjoyed it before too when dead stock.
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Glen Hamner, Jr
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#7 Post by Glen Hamner, Jr »

Interesting adjustment feature Ashley on the front sway bar. When the wheels are loaded, does the adjustment lever arm still protrude downward or does it level out more evenly with the underbody? Good to see my favorite shocks on your suspension, also love their lifetime warranty. Our '89 Expedition finally wore out the Bilsteins this last year, a new set and new bushings across the front suspension put it all back the way it felt in the beginning. Yes, I gladly paid shipping both ways, returning the old shocks for their evaluation.

Thanks for verifying your impression of all these refinements. My reading of what others have accomplished to improve the enjoyment of a 356 over an ever winding open road has brought me to about the same summary of adjustments you presented. Our project is still in its restoration phase, so postings like yours just helps build a fire in me to bring it all back together and out on the road again.

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Ashley Page
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#8 Post by Ashley Page »

glen hamner wrote:When the wheels are loaded, does the adjustment lever arm still protrude downward or does it level out more evenly with the underbody?
At static ride height, on the ground, the sway bar arm is about parallel to the road or bottom of the car and the link is more or less perpendicular to the arm. The sway bar arm follows the trailing arm through its travel.

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Martin Benade
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#9 Post by Martin Benade »

Ashley, how big is that front bar,and how much stiffer than stock? It looks huge in the picture.
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Ashley Page
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#10 Post by Ashley Page »

Sitting here with my ipad I don't remember the exact size of the adjustable bar or the stock bar. I do remember the new one was a little larger plus the effective length was shorter which makes it stiffer also. In this picture you can guess the size. Trying to remember - I think the ends are .875" diameter. They are supported in self aligning ball bearings. As can be seen, the center is smaller than .875" - I will guess .82". Two things at work are diameter and effective length.
I can measure all this tomorrow and let you know.

I will add that the front bar change was driven by what could be fit in the stock location without modifying the car. The stock bar can be bolted back in just like it left the factory. That said Schroeder Steering in Burbank, who made the bar, had options in my end diameter requirement that were larger than I felt I needed. If there is interest in one call Gary Schroeder and he can make what you need.
I made the bearing holders to fit the stock location and modified Schroeder arms to work - Gary made the bar.
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Martin Benade
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#11 Post by Martin Benade »

I am thinking that is maybe twice as stiff as stock, not what I would like but it looks very nicely done, and not as thick as I thought from the earlier picture. Also, does anybody know what the camber regulator does to roll stiffness, does it increase or decrease it, or somehow neither?
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Ashley Page
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#12 Post by Ashley Page »

I have the numbers at my shop so will let you know.
As for the regulator it doesn't add much if any roll stiffness. Maybe that is something that Vic can comment on.

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Vic Skirmants
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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#13 Post by Vic Skirmants »

My camber regulator adds NO roll stiffness. It simply helps prevent the standard swing-axle droop.

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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#14 Post by Ashley Page »

Stock bar is .63" dia. (16mm) and 35" long
My bar is .72" dia. (18.2mm) and 29" long

126lb vs 65lb so roughly twice as stiff.

The ends of my bar are .75" dia which is all the dia I could use and fit the bearing in the unmodified stock location.

The car handles very well but on fast bumpy roads the rear is harsher or stiffer than I would like. Smaller diameter rear torsion bars is a change I would like to try.

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Re: Any stock appearing cars with race mechanicals out there

#15 Post by Conrad Carter »

Great info. Want to see more!
Conrad

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