Wood wheel on eBay

[Michael Doyle]

As a detatched observer and reader of this thread I can no longer sit on the sidelines. I am not a steering wheel expert self appointed or otherwise. However I live in Jackson Wy. home of Rennwagen and my friend Bill Doyle. Over the years I have seen many original spyders and GTs with factory VDM GT wooden steering wheels. I have been hired by Bill to restore and refinish some of those wheels. I have also owned three original VDM GT steering wheels. From what I've seen posted as VDM or Nardi I can tell you it is not a VDM. The wood work is different and the species of wood looks different. Also the shape and number of finger grooves is off. And where are the rivets? There should be an obvious joint where the 1/4 round is glued in, sometimes in a contrasting shade, I do not see it. Also the VDM logo in the latest posting looks too fat to be a real stamp used back in the day. All the VDM stamping I have seen is much smaller and finer. I'm only speaking of A splined flat VDM wood wheels. Not that I know it all but have been involved with A style Porsches for 40 yrs and have never seen a dished VDM GT wheel. Also, as was said up thread the slots on the alu frame are way off. They could be out there but one would think by now I might have seen one.

Steve,

The Steering Wheels being represented as VDM by Leva "may" have been originally made by Petri. I don't know this as fact, and why I said "may". But Petri did make many, many versions of steering wheels, and perhaps did the versions being discussed that have VDM hubs inside them.

I don't see any VDM wood wheels shown of his that were officially fitted by Porsche or Porsche dealerships.

Michael

[steve shea]

Michael, I said they could be out there. The wheel in question, the dished GT looking one does not even have a proper VDM hub!! The horn ring side looks like a Nardi Knock off and the back side is a one off. I think as Jim said there is very clever machine work being done to adapt these mystery wheels. I do not know anything about Petri wheels. Did they make a copy of the VDM GT? I did not know they made wooden wheels. BTW there seems to be a cottage industry in fake steering wheels being passed off as NOS/OEM either by omission or commission. I know of some good reproduction wheels being advertised as repros that are well done and the hubs are completely machined and stamped like VDM. But the advertiser is not trying to fool anyone. As said up thread I have never seen a dished GT where they could have and should most likely have been; on spyders and GT cars. I'll ask Bill if he's seen one.SS

[Michael Doyle]

Michael, I said they could be out there. The wheel in question, the dished GT looking one does not even have a proper VDM hub!! The horn ring side looks like a Nardi Knock off and the back side is a one off. I think as Jim said there is very clever machine work being done to adapt these mystery wheels. I do not know anything about Petri wheels. Did they make a copy of the VDM GT? I did not know they made wooden wheels. BTW there seems to be a cottage industry in fake steering wheels being passed off as NOS/OEM either by omission or commission. I know of some good reproduction wheels being advertised as repros that are well done and the hubs are completely machined and stamped like VDM. But the advertiser is not trying to fool anyone. As said up thread I have never seen a dished GT where they could have and should most likely have been; on spyders and GT cars. I'll ask Bill if he's seen one.SS

Hi Steve...your input is very good reading.

My suggestion (only) is that Petri and I say "may" have been the manufacturer of some these odd wood wheels that Leva has been marketing.

I also said "I don't see any VDM wood wheels shown of his that were officially fitted by Porsche or Porsche dealerships." They appear to be wheels made for other makes and models...but being represented as original to Porsche 356, etc., which, again, they are not.

Regarding reproduction steering wheels that are stamped with VDM on the hub...that's weird too, as it makes them become even more fake with that stamping. It's nice that high quality reproduction steering wheels are being made, but you need to know what you're buying ever so much these days. And especially second or third hand from a private party.

Q: Does anyone know what the initials V - D - M mean...? They must have been a supplier to the coachbuilder Reutter, as it was Reutter that fit the wheels during assembly. Porsche sure used a lot of them...

Michael

[Charlie White]

VDM is Vereinigte Deutsche Metallwerke A.G., a Porsche supplier.

CW

[Roy Lock]

[quote

Hi Steve...your input is very good reading.

My suggestion (only) is that Petri and I say "may" have been the manufacturer of some these odd wood wheels that Leva has been marketing.
Michael

MD
can you provide information that lead to your speculation? A "maybe" nithout substantiated proof is only spectulation and only serves to cloud the real issue at hand that of Leva's wheels.
That is unless you are saying with 100% certainty that wheels discussed are 100% authentic period correct original wheels. In which case the clan of troublemakers must fall on our swords.
A simple :maybe" won't hack it because of the substantial money involved.

[Michael Doyle]

VDM is Vereinigte Deutsche Metallwerke A.G., a Porsche supplier.

CW

Thanks Charlie. Nice picture too.

-MD-

ps: Charlie...do you you know if VDM is still in business?

[Freddy Rabbat]

It looks like I am arriving late to this topic... I know at least one 356 that is currently equipped with this steering wheel... it looks nice but for sure it is not a VDM product:

[Michael Doyle]

Roy, Charlie, others...

For a long time it's been something of a mystery (to more than just me) about the "real" Porsche-VDM wood steering wheels. Perhaps this thread can bring about some real answers to their origin.

I'll continue to say "May" or Maybe" about Petri being involved with VDM and go on to add this...that Nardi "May" have been contracted to do the wood for the VDM wheels as well.

I don't know...but it would be nice have a clear and correct understanding.

Michael

ps: and Charlie..."Vereinigte Deutsche Metallwerke" is quite a mouthful, isn't it. Let's stick with VDM : )

[steve shea]

I do not think Nardi or Petri did contract work for the VDM A splined GT wood wheel. The wood work is unique, the species is consistently on VDM only and they were probably labor intensive to build plus they were never marketed outside of Porsche. The original Nardis I have worked on of the same period were significantly different. Also they were marketed for a number of different car makes in the aftermarket, not the VDM GT. The VDM is comparatively rare and commands a high price for an original. I could be off base but in terms of research I have fertile ground here with Rennwagen and Bill Doyle. I have seen many originals with never any indication that It was built by anyone but VDM. Even the Machine work on the hubs and the frames are unique to VDM. Has anyone ever seen a wood Petri of any sort? I think this may be speculation.

[Bob Campbell]

Hi Michael,

Good seeing your Coupe in Monterey.

Isn't it funny how people can precieve things;

You said adding an accurate VDM stamp would make a reproduction wheel look "more fake".

To me it just makes it a better reproduction.

Go figure.

Regards,

Bob

[Michael Doyle]

Steve...the suggestion about Petri came from a (supposedly) creditable source on historical VW Forum site. Apparently those fella's had been discussing the "Leva" steering wheels as well. Wondering what the heck was going on...and what they were? I guess we're not alone.

Bill Brown started this thread. It would be nice to hear from Bill his thoughts on the wood wheel origins, and for instance, "if" Nardi "may" have had any dealing with VDM as a supplier. And, please, that is a basic, simple question...not a speculative answer.

Michael

[Michael Doyle]

Hi Michael,

Good seeing your Coupe in Monterey.

Isn't it funny how people can precieve things;

You said adding an accurate VDM stamp would make a reproduction wheel look "more fake".

To me it just makes it a better reproduction.

Go figure.

Regards,

Bob

Hi Bob,

It was good to see you too. How come I wasn't surprised to see you there at the PRCC! Yes, Monterey and Carmel were fantastic.

You're right about perception, and how it may even relate to a VDM stamping. I earlier inquired with Charlie if he knew about VDM still being in business? Do you happen to know if they are or not?

If VDM is out of business...how did their stamp get put on to a new repo steering wheel? Can anybody just do that..? If VDM is still in business, aren't there laws about using other company names or logos?

Michael

[Roy Lock]

Steve...the suggestion about Petri came from a (supposedly) creditable source on historical VW Forum site. Apparently those fella's had been discussing the "Leva" steering wheels as well. Wondering what the heck was going on...and what they were? I guess we're not alone.

Bill Brown started this thread. It would be nice to hear from Bill his thoughts on the wood wheel origins, and for instance, "if" Nardi "may" have had any dealing with VDM as a supplier. And, please, that is a basic, simple question...not a speculative answer.

Michael

Michael, you still have not answered my question directly. So, what is your source to substantiate your claims of a Petri wood wheel?

Unless you can back up the claim, then this only clouds the issue of her wheel.

Are you saying her wheel is a Petri?

[Michael Doyle]

Steve...the suggestion about Petri came from a (supposedly) creditable source on historical VW Forum site. Apparently those fella's had been discussing the "Leva" steering wheels as well. Wondering what the heck was going on...and what they were? I guess we're not alone.

Bill Brown started this thread. It would be nice to hear from Bill his thoughts on the wood wheel origins, and for instance, "if" Nardi "may" have had any dealing with VDM as a supplier. And, please, that is a basic, simple question...not a speculative answer.

Michael

Michael, you still have not answered my question directly. So, what is your source to substantiate your claims of a Petri wood wheel?

Unless you can back up the claim, then this only clouds the issue of her wheel.

Are you saying her wheel is a Petri?

No Roy...and please don't try and put words in my mouth...that's not good. Just read again what I already said inside the little white box.

Michael

[Charlie White]

http://www.thyssenkrupp-vdm-usa.com/web ... dex-1.html

VDM still exists as part of the German Company ThyssenKrupp. Those of you know Germany history know the name Krupp, a major German arms supplier throughout German history.

CW