Page 1 of 1

headlight lens

Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:49 am
by Eric Cherneff
What is the correct headlight lens for a 1961? I researched here and on the Samba, and understand it should NOT have "SB19 SB20 SB21" on it (1963? and later), and would likely be made by Hella.

The equivalent VW part at the time had a VW logo and "E1.0671.01" across bottom, Hella at the top, and "25484" in lower left corner.

Did Porsche use the same one, or did they have one without the VW logo on it?

The Hella assemblies that were on the car when I bought it 2 years ago are date stamped for late 1960 which is correct for the car. However, one lens has SB19 etc. on it, and the other is completely devoid of markings, so I assume it is repro.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:44 am
by Jan Kolm
The correct Hella sealed-beam lens has a large Hella logo at the bottom and two rows of data that follow the curved bottom of the lens. These were produced from ~1958 until late 1963 and are correct for adssemblies with adjusting screws at the 5 and 7 o'clock positions.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:08 pm
by Eric Cherneff
Thanks Jan - one point of clarification - they do not have VW logos on them?

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:35 pm
by Jim Breazeale
Here is a picture of an unrestored headlight. According to Paul's data it was made in the 3rd week of January 1961.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:56 am
by Eric Cherneff
Thanks Jim, very helpful. You wouldn't have a really nice pair of lens like this available do you? Please contact me offline if you do.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 12:29 pm
by Jan Kolm
Jim Breazeale wrote:... According to Paul's data it was made in the 3rd week of January 1961.
I did the Hella date code research and posted it on the Samba. Paul simply pulled it from there and included it in his article. He just couldn't assign credit for it because I posted it anonomously. At the time i finished the research (~2000), nobody on the 356Talk forum, other than Brad Ripley and I, had much of an interest in deciphering date codes. The VW Barndoor Bus community, on the other hand, had an extreme interest, so that's where they ended up.

Part numbers for the late T-2/356B clear lenses are -3-60370 and 4-60370. There may be others. Correct lenses have no VW logos on them.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 1:55 pm
by Joris Koning
Jan,

Thank you very much for the great research you did. I believe back in 2000 there were also other people interested in this kind of research. They might not have been aware of your work.

Joris

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:03 pm
by Bob DiCorpo
Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 10:55 pm
by Jan Kolm
Bob DiCorpo wrote:Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob
Bob,

The picture in Brett Johnson's authenticity books doesn't give a lot of detail, But I believe early 356A lenses have a small Hella logo at the bottom and (possibly) no numbers on the face of the lens. Very early 356A (1955 production) lenses may still have the "vestigial oval" in the center of the lens.

The part number (60370?) is cast into the backside of the lip at the top, along with the Hella name. A single digit number (2?) is cast into the lip at the bottom.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 8:55 am
by roy mawbey
My 59 T2 "A" delivered into the UK in mid 59 still has the original headlight lenses. They are however Bosch headlights although original other lighting items on my car are Hella.

I presume? the Bosch headlights went onto cars delivered to Europe and Hella went to the USA? Mine are of course not sealed beam, more like candle beam :)

I attach 2 photos taken a while back
2010_0206headlamps0004.JPG
2010_0206headlamps0002.JPG
Roy
RHD356Asuper75 106954

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 11:56 am
by Chuck House
Jan Kolm wrote:
Bob DiCorpo wrote:Jan,
Would you know what the original headlight glass for a 1956 Speedster would look like and what numbers and/or logos it would have on it? Thank you, Bob
Bob,

The picture in Brett Johnson's authenticity books doesn't give a lot of detail, But I believe early 356A lenses have a small Hella logo at the bottom and (possibly) no numbers on the face of the lens. Very early 356A (1955 production) lenses may still have the "vestigial oval" in the center of the lens.

The part number (60370?) is cast into the backside of the lip at the top, along with the Hella name. A single digit number (2?) is cast into the lip at the bottom.
Here is an early 56 356A lens with the "vestigial oval".

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 1:54 pm
by Bob DiCorpo
Thank you Chuck and Jan. I've never seen this type of lens. They must be difficult to come by. Regards, Bob

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 10:33 pm
by Richard Koenig
Thanks, Jan, for your comments about the SB 19-21 lenses.
Unfortunately I am now confused because I thought these lenses started much earlier, around 1959. Also, I don't know now which headlight rings are correct and which headlight units should be used. I have several NOS headlight rings with the 5 & 7 holes at the bottom and some restored buckets for the same with holes for parking light bulbs.
Is there a summary chart somewhere that I could refer to? If so, will you kindly send me a reference?
Thanks, Dick Koenig, Denver.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:01 am
by Jan Kolm
Dick,

There are three basic varieties of Hella rings with holes at 5 and 7 o'clock used on 356s.

The first type has a single rivet securing the mounting tab and a rolled inner lip. These were used until sometime in 1954.

The second type has two rivets securing the mounting tab and a rolled inner lip. These were used 1954-55.

The third type has two rivets and no rolled inner lip. These were used from about the end of calendar year 1955 to the end of calendar year 1963.

As for the buckets w/parking light holes--if they are the type with the single, bail type spring across the bottom, there are no real differences 1956-63, other than the paint.
- 1956-58: Gloss black w/ silver inside
- 1959: Silver inside and out
- 1960-63: Matte gray inside and out

U.S. market 356Bs do not use the parking light in the bucket - a blanking plate was used 1960 - ~1962 and the hole was eliminated during the 1962 or 1963 model years. I do not believe Brett Johnson has well-defined transition points by chassis numbers.

Re: headlight lens

Posted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 11:26 pm
by Greg Bryan
If you're not aware, there is a headlight lens thread 'sticky' with 7 pages of discussion
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33980
After this discussion runs its course, I will merge this discussion into the sticky thread