356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
I inherited my 1964 356C from my dad and it has the original lenses which are clear. I pulled out my copy of "A Restorer's Guide to Authenticity" and it indicates that U.S. late cars had clear lenses.
Mike
Mike
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
My 63 coupe chassis number 213246 came with clear (white) lenses.
Roy Lock
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
My 63 B was manufactured in '62 (vin # 211075). I am the second owner, and have owned the car since '73. It has amber lenses.
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
My 63 356B had clear lenses when I got her in 1995. Have since converted to orange lenses in the need for better visibility.
Pat Daily
Midlothian, VA
356B coupe (121123 aka "Fast Frieda")
Midlothian, VA
356B coupe (121123 aka "Fast Frieda")
- Paul Hatfield
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
The judge claimed this change was not until some 64 models but included ALL USA 65 models.
I have always thought of the orange front turn signals as European, but perhaps this is not correct for the last of the 356's.
Paul
I have always thought of the orange front turn signals as European, but perhaps this is not correct for the last of the 356's.
Paul
Paul Hatfield
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
Charlie-
I hesitate to give the answer here on 356 Talk because I did not ask him for any permission to use his name and drag him into this. If you e-mail be below, I will tell you personally off line.
He owns a 67 911 S that has one many awards, and a 356 that is also a winner. Including the last Parade.
He lives here in Washington State. He has been a judge for decades.
Paul
I hesitate to give the answer here on 356 Talk because I did not ask him for any permission to use his name and drag him into this. If you e-mail be below, I will tell you personally off line.
He owns a 67 911 S that has one many awards, and a 356 that is also a winner. Including the last Parade.
He lives here in Washington State. He has been a judge for decades.
Paul
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
If you want to trust the source, Wikipedia notes that the Federal standard was not mandatory until 1968.
"Amber front turn signals were voluntarily adopted by the auto industry in the USA for most vehicles beginning in the 1963 model year, though front turn signals were still permitted to emit white light until FMVSS 108 took effect for the 1968 model year, whereupon amber became the only permissible colour for front turn signals. "
If that's the case, your judge is wrong.
"Amber front turn signals were voluntarily adopted by the auto industry in the USA for most vehicles beginning in the 1963 model year, though front turn signals were still permitted to emit white light until FMVSS 108 took effect for the 1968 model year, whereupon amber became the only permissible colour for front turn signals. "
If that's the case, your judge is wrong.
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
The "Judge" is "clearly" wrong. He is making an incorrect assumption.Paul Hatfield wrote:The judge claimed this change was not until some 64 models but included ALL USA 65 models.
I have always thought of the orange front turn signals as European, but perhaps this is not correct for the last of the 356's.
Paul
Can I assume that the "Judge's" initials are EL?
65 models had clear lenses along with every other 356 delivered in the USA.
Regards
Jim Breazeale
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
Jim-
Thanks! And a private e-mail sent to you as well.
Paul
Thanks! And a private e-mail sent to you as well.
Paul
Paul Hatfield
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
While I appreciate Jim's active participation in all topics 356 Porsche, and his background and knowledge about same, I have to wonder, in a friendly way, what is the basis for his pronouncement about all 65 Porsches delivered to the USA having white lenses. That sorta falls into the "Never say Never, and Never say Always" category that needs some substantiation beyond memory. What incorrect assumption is the "judge" guilty of?
CW
CW
Charlie White
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
CharlieCharlie White wrote:While I appreciate Jim's active participation in all topics 356 Porsche, and his background and knowledge about same, I have to wonder, in a friendly way, what is the basis for his pronouncement about all 65 Porsches delivered to the USA having white lenses. That sorta falls into the "Never say Never, and Never say Always" category that needs some substantiation beyond memory. What incorrect assumption is the "judge" guilty of?
CW
Maybe I should not have used the term "all" . You are right, one should never say never. I should have said that it was the "norm" for US delivered cars to have clear lenses. It is correct that 911s made at the same time as 356Cs had amber front lenses for cars delivered in the US. European 911s got amber/white front lenses. Go figure!
Regards
Jim Breazeale
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
I'll bet someone has photos of Porsche's American showrooms from that and other era's. What do the 356's have for turn signals? Even if the photos are black and white you can probably tell if they were colored or clear.
Anyone have photos like that?
Anyone have photos like that?
Dan Macdonald
'59 A Coupe (105327)
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'59 A Coupe (105327)
'57 Speedster (82954)
Registry #1921 (1982)
DMAIA@aol.com
My YouTube Channel: Tinmeister 356
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
Jim,
It may well be that we will not find a definitive answer to this question. It may be sorta like 5.5 wheels. When they came out later, a lot of 356 owners switched out their 4.5's. This switching to newer parts at a later date may be the case here. Maybe owners switched to amber lenses, or maybe some dealers switched them. Anecdotally there are claims of original C cars coming both ways. The "C" parts book is silent on this issue and defers to the prior "B T-6" Supplements which mentions both white and yellow (perhaps meaning amber). A review of the Service Bulletins reveals no mention of a change to amber for either 356-C's in general, or those destined for the USA market.
The following quote from Wikipedia, seems to suggest that in 1963, most of the auto industry Voluntarily switched to amber front turn signals, but that a required switch did not come until 1968. Perhaps some Porsche dealers voluntarily switched to amber lenses. "Until the early 1960s, most front turn signals worldwide emitted white light and most rear turn signals emitted red. Amber front turn signals were voluntarily adopted by the auto industry in the USA for most vehicles beginning in the 1963 model year, though front turn signals were still permitted to emit white light until FMVSS 108 took effect for the 1968 model year, whereupon amber became the only permissible colour for front turn signals.
CW
It may well be that we will not find a definitive answer to this question. It may be sorta like 5.5 wheels. When they came out later, a lot of 356 owners switched out their 4.5's. This switching to newer parts at a later date may be the case here. Maybe owners switched to amber lenses, or maybe some dealers switched them. Anecdotally there are claims of original C cars coming both ways. The "C" parts book is silent on this issue and defers to the prior "B T-6" Supplements which mentions both white and yellow (perhaps meaning amber). A review of the Service Bulletins reveals no mention of a change to amber for either 356-C's in general, or those destined for the USA market.
The following quote from Wikipedia, seems to suggest that in 1963, most of the auto industry Voluntarily switched to amber front turn signals, but that a required switch did not come until 1968. Perhaps some Porsche dealers voluntarily switched to amber lenses. "Until the early 1960s, most front turn signals worldwide emitted white light and most rear turn signals emitted red. Amber front turn signals were voluntarily adopted by the auto industry in the USA for most vehicles beginning in the 1963 model year, though front turn signals were still permitted to emit white light until FMVSS 108 took effect for the 1968 model year, whereupon amber became the only permissible colour for front turn signals.
CW
Charlie White
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Re: 356 C Front Turn Signals- USA
Charlie
I switched my white lenses for amber ones soon after buying my first 356B Roadster in 1972. I thought the amber ones looked better. Some people make assumptions based on one or two cars. That is not a large enough sample. Saying that late 356Cs came with amber front lenses is simply not true. I take that statement to mean that all late 356Cs came with amber lenses. There may have been a few but they certainly weren't the standard.
Regards
I switched my white lenses for amber ones soon after buying my first 356B Roadster in 1972. I thought the amber ones looked better. Some people make assumptions based on one or two cars. That is not a large enough sample. Saying that late 356Cs came with amber front lenses is simply not true. I take that statement to mean that all late 356Cs came with amber lenses. There may have been a few but they certainly weren't the standard.
Regards
Jim Breazeale
www.easypor.com
www.facebook.com/pages/European-Auto-Salvage-Yard-EASY/120458108029410
www.easypor.com
www.facebook.com/pages/European-Auto-Salvage-Yard-EASY/120458108029410