Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registry?

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Larry Brooks
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Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registry?

#1 Post by Larry Brooks » Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:07 pm

I read the posts bemoaning the loss of My356Speedster.com and started to post my question there. But think a new topic is in order rather than hijack that thread. Also this is an important topic that deserves its own thread. I remember questions about this in the past. Many people disliked the change. But, here we are still not a registry anymore.

As I stated in the Subject title - Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registry? Why? I've heard vague concerns about privacy issues.

I find the "Privacy Concerns" argument to be pretty lame. It would be a very simple matter to not show ownership details, but show all of the known details of the car. I also doubt it would be difficult to have a way to contact the current owner of registered cars. A simple email to the owner would suffice and they could choose whether to respond to the person making the query.

The VIN DB header at the top of this page has become a sad reminder of one of great resources that used to be available to members. It is so out of date now that it is virtually useless. I used to use it all of the time to supplement my own research on cars/engines/transaxles I encountered. It was also interesting to see patterns in Porsche manufacturing.

So if it's not a Registry anymore perhaps a new name would be more appropriate? Maybe "Old Guys Who Want to Talk About 356's Club"

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David Jones
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#2 Post by David Jones » Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:49 pm

Larry, I am in agreement with you. I personally have no issues with posting the details of my cars in the database.
If I had known I would live this long I would have pushed the envelope a little harder.
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Dan Epperly
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#3 Post by Dan Epperly » Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:53 pm

David Jones wrote:Larry, I am in agreement with you. I personally have no issues with posting the details of my cars in the database.
Same here. Maybe they need an opt out clause.

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Adam Wright
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#4 Post by Adam Wright » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:25 pm

I always thought it was strange, like if Baskin Robbins stopped selling ice cream. We are, or were, the 356 Registry. One of the first things people do when they get their car is try and trace the history of the car, but now that info is not being collected, at least not officially. It's bad enough that Porsche won't give you engine numbers anymore with a COA, but now our own club is stifling the registrar's efforts to collect cars history.
I too think that the privacy concern is weak, if the info is collected from either the owner or from a public ad or post, there should be no expectation of privacy and owners should be given the option of having their info edited if there is such a concern. But a blanket action to stop collecting info I think is both heavy handed and short sighted.

It would be interesting to hear from Bill Block on his thoughts and whoever told him to stop and why.
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#5 Post by Craig Richter » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:34 pm

Hooray! Somebody is talking about this again!
At the Phoenix Club last year, Bill Block and I had a nice, long talk about this Registry position. Undoubtedly, to me at least, this has been most indefensible Board of Trustee decision made in the 50-some years of my membership. No discussion, just a mandate. The fact that some lawyer convinced the Board that they might be opening the club to some possible future liability does not convince me. The fact that there are social concerns today about privacy does not convince me. We are a bright group. There are ways around such concerns.
Thanks, Larry.
 

Larry Brooks
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#6 Post by Larry Brooks » Sun Nov 04, 2018 5:03 pm

Craig Richter wrote:Hooray! Somebody is talking about this again!
At the Phoenix Club last year, Bill Block and I had a nice, long talk about this Registry position. Undoubtedly, to me at least, this has been most indefensible Board of Trustee decision made in the 50-some years of my membership. No discussion, just a mandate. The fact that some lawyer convinced the Board that they might be opening the club to some possible future liability does not convince me. The fact that there are social concerns today about privacy does not convince me. We are a bright group. There are ways around such concerns.
Thanks, Larry.
If we as a club paid for an attorneys opinion on this matter I would like to see his written opinion. Furthermore, I would be interested in seeing his credentials regarding privacy laws and possible liability.

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Adam Wright
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#7 Post by Adam Wright » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:05 pm

Larry Brooks wrote:
Craig Richter wrote:Hooray! Somebody is talking about this again!
At the Phoenix Club last year, Bill Block and I had a nice, long talk about this Registry position. Undoubtedly, to me at least, this has been most indefensible Board of Trustee decision made in the 50-some years of my membership. No discussion, just a mandate. The fact that some lawyer convinced the Board that they might be opening the club to some possible future liability does not convince me. The fact that there are social concerns today about privacy does not convince me. We are a bright group. There are ways around such concerns.
Thanks, Larry.
If we as a club paid for an attorneys opinion on this matter I would like to see his written opinion. Furthermore, I would be interested in seeing his credentials regarding privacy laws and possible liability.
Larry-
You should reach out to some of the Trustee's and report back what they say, they may not see this on the forum.
I always need stories for my Barn Find column in the magazine, if you have a good story to share, please let me know.

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David Jones
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#8 Post by David Jones » Sun Nov 04, 2018 6:13 pm

Maybe it would be a better move to ask an insurance company. They are the ones who would suffer the payout if a car got stolen, though cars get stolen all the time and there are cars that are easier to steal and sell than a 356 which is fully documented down to partial Vin #'s on discrete components. If you drive your car at all then it is going to be hard to keep your ownership a secret from any local potential thief and the folks who find you on line are not that likely to track you down to steal your car unless you make it really easy for them. Let's get real and make it a "registry" again.
If I had known I would live this long I would have pushed the envelope a little harder.
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Larry Brooks
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#9 Post by Larry Brooks » Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:13 pm

Adam Wright wrote:
Larry Brooks wrote:
Craig Richter wrote:Hooray! Somebody is talking about this again!
At the Phoenix Club last year, Bill Block and I had a nice, long talk about this Registry position. Undoubtedly, to me at least, this has been most indefensible Board of Trustee decision made in the 50-some years of my membership. No discussion, just a mandate. The fact that some lawyer convinced the Board that they might be opening the club to some possible future liability does not convince me. The fact that there are social concerns today about privacy does not convince me. We are a bright group. There are ways around such concerns.
Thanks, Larry.
If we as a club paid for an attorneys opinion on this matter I would like to see his written opinion. Furthermore, I would be interested in seeing his credentials regarding privacy laws and possible liability.
Larry-
You should reach out to some of the Trustee's and report back what they say, they may not see this on the forum.
Great suggestion Adam. However, I think it would be better to have them address the issue here, rather than me being a go between (I'm old enough to remember the TV show "Password"). To that end I just sent all of the trustees emails asking them to respond here.

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Vic Skirmants
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#10 Post by Vic Skirmants » Sun Nov 04, 2018 7:59 pm

Thank Steve Heinrichs for all this BS!!!
He started the whole thing, so thank him; god bless his soul!!!

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Curt Dansby
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#11 Post by Curt Dansby » Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:31 pm

Ok, lets start with a few basic points. Bill Block is not a "registrar" nor does he have any official position other than member. Some time before my tenure on the board he was directed specifically, in writing, to stop representing himself as such. The reason behind this was because he was opening peoples doors and collecting information without permission and in some cases (as related to me) posting erroneous information on the site and it pissed people off. I do not intend to enter into any debate regarding what I have posted above. This position is not subject to change.


Now, I am aware that there are major issues with the VIN database in areas that are not even know to the general membership. This was a topic of some discussion at our last meeting and the consensus of the board was the database is a critical facet of the club and its history. Eric Cherneff (who would be the closest thing to a registrar we have as VIN Database Mgr.) is coordinating directly with our web guy to facilitate a major upgrade in functionality to the database. I do not know how long this will take but this was in play prior to this thread being posted. One of the prime intents of this upgrade is to have continuity on a cars history from one owner to the next. Over the many general web upgrades the VIN database lagged but we are now addressing that issue.

As far as the privacy issues: If Joe Doakes buys my car and does not wish to update the information showing him as the new owner of that VIN we are not going to have someone post that information in his stead. Your position on right to privacy may differ greatly from that of "Mr. Doakes".
As far as contacting former owners or other members there is already a methodology to do so in the members section. If a member has provided an e-mail address you can send them a blind e-mail and as someone said "they can choose to respond or not"


Curt

Bob Watts
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#12 Post by Bob Watts » Sun Nov 04, 2018 8:31 pm

So, who would like to help by adding "VINs" to this list?
Add here or direct to my email.
Thanks.
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Bob Watts

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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#13 Post by David Jones » Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:58 pm

Bob, that is an interesting collection of information but what on earth can you derive from it? No order to it and seemingly no way to collate the information into a meaningful data base. Perhaps I am missing something but the idea of a separate registry with no affiliation to the present non registry may be an answer if the board decides it cannot support one. If we all only had access to the Kardex information pertaining to the Vin #'s but without the owners name it would be enough to satisfy the history data base to be able to infer build dates and options. I know enough about my own cars not to want to buy a COA/Kardex with next to no information.
I attach my Kardex and you can judge for yourself if it would be worth what Porsche are asking for it. It does tell me that my car has matching #'s but I can find no trace of silver paint anywhere.
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If I had known I would live this long I would have pushed the envelope a little harder.
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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#14 Post by Bob Watts » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:35 am

David,

The list is Sunroof only, started to try to help answer questions such as when was the first/last...etc., questions that keep popping up.
I see the start of some order; the "VIN" numbers. That is why they are so important. The other cars listed are simply sunroof cars that
are or once have been real 356 sunroof Porsche's. I simply assume one has to start somewhere.
Bob Watts

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Re: Who decided the 356 Registry should quit being a registr

#15 Post by Adam Wright » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:44 am

This is the problem if there isn't someone who actively, not passively, records cars for the 356 Registry, what we get are a bunch of side lists, and registries, many of which get lost on someone's computer. The 356 Registry will outlive us all, so should the knowledge. I know Bill Block was active anytime he saw a car pop up in the public space, that's what we need. If we don't record the history, it will be lost.
I always need stories for my Barn Find column in the magazine, if you have a good story to share, please let me know.

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