New Windshield too big

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PaulAhnell
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New Windshield too big

#1 Post by PaulAhnell » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:10 pm

A stone cracked the windshield on my '60 coupe. I ordered a replacement from a reliable source who specializes in antique and foreign glass, and brought it to a reputable installer. We find the new windshield is ~1/4" larger in height than the old, cracked one. Problematic to install.

I think the old windshield was a "Clear Vue", probably a replacement years ago by a PO.

The invoice for the new one says it is a Pilkington Sigla #FW0034CLNP allegedly for a '60 T5 coupe.

How could that be larger than the old one which fit nicely with the metal surround?

Could the old one be from a '59A coupe? I'm stumped.
Paul Ahnell
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VinceFinaldi
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Re: New Windshield too big

#2 Post by VinceFinaldi » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:18 pm

Sounds like it's from a different model. I know there are slight differences in sizes.

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Re: New Windshield too big

#3 Post by Adam Wright » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:29 pm

PaulAhnell wrote:A stone cracked the windshield on my '60 coupe. I ordered a replacement from a reliable source who specializes in antique and foreign glass, and brought it to a reputable installer. We find the new windshield is ~1/4" larger in height than the old, cracked one. Problematic to install.

I think the old windshield was a "Clear Vue", probably a replacement years ago by a PO.

The invoice for the new one says it is a Pilkington Sigla #FW0034CLNP allegedly for a '60 T5 coupe.

How could that be larger than the old one which fit nicely with the metal surround?

Could the old one be from a '59A coupe? I'm stumped.
What's the exact measurement of the new one? I can cross reference against original and repro that we have.
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Re: New Windshield too big

#4 Post by Martin Benade » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:32 am

That sounds like it was made incorrectly. There isn't anything just one quarter inch taller.

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Re: New Windshield too big

#5 Post by Doug McDonnell » Thu Aug 30, 2018 9:10 am

What does your source say? The number I have for Pilkington is 1-800-848-1351. I picked mine up in Columbus Ohio after ordering it myself for my C coupe but I don't think Pilkington allows individuals to order anymore. A,T5B and all Cabs use the same windshield.
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PaulAhnell
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Re: New Windshield too big

#6 Post by PaulAhnell » Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:51 am

Windshield Dims.pdf
(190.32 KiB) Downloaded 30 times
All: Thanks for your thoughts and suggestions. Shop spoke with windshield Vendor (deals with him regularly) who says he has sold a number of the Pilkington Silgas w/o problems. I understand Pilkington bought Silga but still uses Silga name on glass.

The rubber gasket is a new Porsche part purchased from local dealer. Shop says things change over 60 years. (oh yeah?) Maybe they can try old gasket again which still looks to be quite serviceable. Also suggested possibility of taking windshield to a local specialty glass shop to have it ground down to make a comfortable fit. Scares me just thinking about it but shop says it can/has been done..."but you never know".

Adam: Thanks for the offer to take measurements. I've attached a sketch comparing old and new Centerline measurements if they are helpful. Tough to get accurate measurements on those compound curves but the new glass is definitely larger top to bottom by 1/8"-1/4". Had planned to visit you Saturday in my sled but that won't happen now. If you have a match with the old dims, maybe I can make the run from Lyme in the Forester.
Paul Ahnell
'60 Normal Coupe

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Re: New Windshield too big

#7 Post by Adam Wright » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:53 pm

Paul, here is a sampling of three. If you're coming out on Saturday we can take more accurate measurements. If you are hoping for keeping with new glass you might want to take your old one over to the vendor and match it up. I think with the repro glass there can be some size variation sometimes.
Attachments
IMG_2296.jpg
IMG_2295.jpg
IMG_2294.jpg
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Re: New Windshield too big

#8 Post by Brad Ripley » Thu Aug 30, 2018 12:55 pm

There is often a confusion between the "short" glass for early coupes and all cabrios versus the "tall" glass for T-6/C coupes. The difference in height is about one inch. The correct windshield for a 356B T-5 coupe is Porsche 644-541-101-00 or Stoddard NLA number NLA-541-101-00. The old glass industry number was FCW-34.

Current production glasses have the "bug" in the photo below.

Paul, I suggest you return the glass over there to Pilkington and order up the correct glass https://www.stoddard.com/64454110100-nla.html.html
Attachments
Sigla bug 101-00.jpg
Sigla bug 101-00.jpg (7.97 KiB) Viewed 698 times

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Re: New Windshield too big

#9 Post by George Hussey » Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:57 pm

several years ago I purchased a new back window for my 65 SC directly from Porsche and still had the old original that had some scratches. The window was too large and I had to send it back, they had made it incorrectly
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Re: New Windshield too big

#10 Post by Martin Benade » Thu Aug 30, 2018 2:24 pm

My Stoddard cab windshield is 1/8" too big on one end, I didn't have the nerve to get it ground and it is installed. I can see the imperfect fit but in my case it is almost imperceptible. I am sure Stoddard would have easily exchanged it had I asked. A quarter inch however would not be able to fit. Grinding it to fit is no big deal, except that nobody will guarantee not to break it. Part of the manufacturing process usually includes such grinding.
Last edited by Martin Benade on Fri Aug 31, 2018 10:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PaulAhnell
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Re: New Windshield too big

#11 Post by PaulAhnell » Thu Aug 30, 2018 5:26 pm

Adam: Thanks for taking those pix. It looks like you have the same measurements as my new Sigla, ~1/8 - 3/16 larger than the old glass.

Brad: The Stoddard product is touted as 14 1/2" high. Not sure if that's a vertical dim or following the curve, but either way it is larger than my old 14 5/16" glass.

George: Interesting on the oversize but from the above, that looks like it was an aberration.

Sooo, I'm baffled. Somewhere along the line the original windshield was replaced with the 14 5/16" "Safe Vue" glass which the windshield vendor says was a popular product a while back but NLA. Where and why would the PO use an odd size? Was it ground down to fit? Why? How can the windshield opening shrink?

Headed back to shop to measure old and new rubber gaskets more closely.

Keep those thoughts and ideas coming. Thanks.
Paul Ahnell
'60 Normal Coupe

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Re: New Windshield too big

#12 Post by Roy Smalley » Thu Aug 30, 2018 5:50 pm

A&B
T-5 windshields are the same, as well as for all A forward cabriolets. My suspicion is your original while it might fit, was a low quality AM unit.

During the years after first production until fairly recently, many aftermarket windshields circumference and thickness varied quite a bit.

The units offered by Stoddard have been consistently sized, with the Sigla mark. There are other suppliers that offer windshields, but Stoddard is who we dance with at present.
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Re: New Windshield too big

#13 Post by Brad Ripley » Thu Aug 30, 2018 7:30 pm

Of course, I don't want to start battle ..... BUT, from personal experience, Stoddard NLA sells many of this exact glass per year with virtually no returns. The majority of sales go to restoration shops. So the Stoddard windshields must fit or we would hear about it. These are in-stock parts imported directly from Europe.

Paul, it don't know about the windshield you bought. However, I can suggest you return it and purchase a good one from a company that's been in the 356 business since 1957.

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Re: New Windshield too big

#14 Post by Jim Liberty » Thu Aug 30, 2018 7:36 pm

Brad you are soooo subtle. But I agree. .....................Jim.
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PaulAhnell
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Re: New Windshield too big

#15 Post by PaulAhnell » Thu Aug 30, 2018 8:44 pm

Ouch! Of course. Actually, Brad, the windshield I bought has the same Sigla insignia as you show above, and is dimensionally correct IAW Adam's Pix. It's the real McCoy even if it was at a (ahem) substantial discount to Stoddard's advertised price. Have to admit, I bought it from a wholesaler who sells to restoration and glass shops all over N.E., and drove two hours to pick it up. But I do buy 98% of my parts from Stoddard. Ask Maurice.

So, the question is: Why won't it (and, I'm sure, Stoddard's) fit? The shop and I went over the pillars and posts and the whole windshield area and can't find any evidence of cutting and fitting outside the factory. Maybe this car was out of whack when fabbed, the roof just a skoshe too low, and a glass adjustment e.g. cut, sand, was made at the factory and later to make it fit. No doubt in my mind that my new Sigla windshield is dimensionally correct to spec. It's just seems that the receiving space is too small. I was once caught the rain. Maybe it shrunk.

On the other hand...The new windshield is to spec. The old one is below spec. the new gasket is OEM from Porsche and its dims seem to be to be the same as the old gasket's dims. Maybe the shop just has to try harder.

Anyway, stay tuned. Shop and I are still discussing options.
Paul Ahnell
'60 Normal Coupe

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