Monterey Mecum auction???

[David Jones]

Why did the 65 SC coupe sell for $260K? What was so special about it? Why did a "C" cab sell for less than a "B" coupe? Why does it not make sense to me? Are there a lot of drunk people bidding or just buyers who do not know one end of a 356 from a Karmann Ghia? Who Buys a wrecked 959 for close to a half million $, and many other questions I do not know the answer to.

[C J Murray]

A 1962 Super Coupe sold for $143,000 which is of interest to me since I have the same car in I think the same condition for sale now in our classifieds. Hagerty #1 value is $131k so at 143 that car sold for about the right price. Mine is much less.

A 63 coupe was sold for 49.5. A 65 SC coupe was no sale at 120. A 64 C coupe was a no sale at 50.

The Cabriolets... 1960 sold 148,500, 1965 SC sold 297,000.

David, maybe you confused the SC cab for an SC coupe?

I wasn't there but it seems clear that condition and uniqueness drove the difference in sale prices. The SC cab was triple black from the factory. The 143k 62 coupe was Oslo blue/red from the factory. Both were restored by Tom Drummond. I don't know his work but I assume it is good.

Some on this forum have lower standards and would be happy with a $50k coupe however you can't start with a 50k coupe and get to a 143k coupe for the 93k difference.

The funniest thing I saw was a description of the 60 Cab...

has earned the Porsche Club of America Gold Award at the Lone Star Regional in Texas with an almost perfect score of 179.9 of 180 points

The seller did well to get 1/2 as much as the SC Cab, it just wasn't very nice.

Condition and uniqueness!

[Mark Pribanic]

I'm guessing the 959 is going to be rebuilt and resold by someone like Canepa. If you've ever been to his place outside of Santa Cruz you have probably seen several 959's during your visit. There were five 959's when I last visited.

[C J Murray]

I'm guessing the 959 is going to be rebuilt and resold by someone like Canepa. If you've ever been to his place outside of Santa Cruz you have probably seen several 959's during your visit. There were five 959's when I last visited.

I'm driving my family around in a rented diesel minivan with manual transmission somewhere in Switzerland(I think) entering a small resort town where there happened to be some sort of tennis match. Maybe that will indicate to somebody where I was since I have no memory and we were jumping around between France, Italy, Switzerland, Germany, and Austria. That's the way we roll, disorganized and rubbing elbows with the locals in the more obscure towns. It was when the new Alfa 8C was out in Europe but not imported to the US. I'm well out of town on a 2 lane rural road and I see a small quiet car shop with a glass front and an Alfa 8C in the window. The ABS breaking system worked well in the minivan and after a few screams from my passengers we had pulled up in front of the window. I walked in drooling and an attractive well dressed woman asked if I could be helped and then realized that I was beyond help. She was very helpful, very nice, the place was not busy.

Oh, now I remember... almost as an afterthought I looked beyond the Alfa to see what other cars were there. They had at least 3 959s! I liked the Alfa better but I did have to ask her how they happened to have so many 959s to which she answered that they were sort of a specialty for them. I left thinking how weird of a place it was out in the country but I think that it was a very wealthy area so the shop was probably a hobby for someone.

Maybe you can't just own ONE 959?

[Ned Hamlin]

I was at Mecum, where we bought a 2004 GT3 and a '57 sunroof coupe. Both cars we got for substantially below the estimate range, which says that mid-range cars are currently a little soft. High end cars did fairly well.
The '62 coupe (I think it was Oslo blue) was a very nice car and got a good price. Some of the cars were tarted examples prepared recently just for auction. The black '65 SC cab had some issues, and in my mind went very high. One restorer (Drummond) did most of the cars, and the results were mixed. There was a fairly rough unrestored slate grey/fawn SC that bid to $60k and was a no-sale.
The other auction houses had very few 356's, and what they had didn't interest us much, so we focused on Mecum.
We bid on the wrecked 959, but either the factory or Canepa got the car for a very high price. Too many stories on that car, as we did an inspection with Tony Callas and there were some mods.

[C J Murray]

Ned, that is very interesting. The triple black Cab was also a Drummond car but finished a few years ago. Did it look like the restoration just didn't hold up or was the car abused over the past few years?

[Ned Hamlin]

Ned, that is very interesting. The triple black Cab was also a Drummond car but finished a few years ago. Did it look like the restoration just didn't hold up or was the car abused over the past few years?

I didn't do a full inspection of the car. When I saw the foggy lenses on the speedo and tach, and the protruding jack spur on the passenger side, I didn't go any further.

[C J Murray]

Thanks, I get it.

[Robert Thiemrodt]

I know what you see on tv/YouTube as the auction is taking place, and what they tell you as the car is on the block, is not always one in the same. I attended Mecum Monterey a few years back. At the same time I set my DVR to record the whole Mecum auction weekend. I saw a silver 356 speedster in person. The car, imo was a poor restoration. The gaps were not good, there was a paint bubble the size of a Kennedy half dollar right at the front hood handle. You could push on the bubble and it would spring back up. On the back under the Porsche script was a Speedster emblem, as opposed to the engine size emblem. When it was crossing the block the auctioneer announced the car as a beautiful frame off rotisserie restoration. Had I been sitting at home watching, I would have thought the value of speedsters was on the decline, when in fact, this particular car did not warrant big money.

[Dave Finburgh]

Many years ago, I attended an auction at Monterey...not Mecum’s. At that auction I bid on a 1926 MG Brooklands racer and a1929 MG racer.i won the 1926 car and lost the 1929 car...to a bidder who paid $400k for that car.
Both of these cars looked excellent, and they both were seemingly great deals...
After I took delivery of the MG, I sent the numbers to the MG club in the UK for their build sheet and cert of authenticity. I was extremely shocked when they told me that my car was a replica that had been built in the last year and shipped to the seller in Texas...who had subsequently sent it to this auction...along with the 1929 car...Also a fake!
Now I didn’t pay anything like $400k for mine, but still a fairly substantial amount...considering the time. I had my attorney contact the auction house, who graciously agreed to run the car through their next auction in Palm Springs and if it didn’t meet the amount that I had paid for the car, to reimburse me the difference. Naturally, and at my insistence, a full disclosure of what the car was would be stated by the auctioneer at the next auction. At the Palm Springs event, the car reached a mere fraction of what I had paid, and after the auction, the auction house told me to sue them, as they felt they were duped by the Texas seller and wouldn’t accept this loss. Sure enough, they lost in court and I received a judgement against them.Years later, I found out that the guy who paid $400k for the other car, lost everything and was still trying to find the Texas seller and was still in court with the auction company.

Long story..short...be VERY careful of these auction houses and their automobile auction events.


‘65 C Cab 161176

[C J Murray]

Dave!!!! Thank you, thank you, thank you for telling your story!

I have attended a few auctions at Amelia Island and although some wonderful cars are sold there I also have seen terrible cars sold there. I think a process that is sped up to a fever pace is useful to cover up fraud. Fraud comes in many forms, some like your experience and some in the form of poor restoration work hidden by shiny paint or restamped numbers. When I buy a car I like to take enough time to get comfortable before writing a check.

Does anybody think that an auction house really gives a poop about anything but their commission?

[Vic Skirmants]

+1

[David Jones]

I think perhaps BAT do give a rats arxse about their rep from all the many auctions I have watched. They get such a microscopic examination from onlookers and with so many comments that it would be hard to slip anything through that was in any way suspicious. If and when I sell any of my cars it will be by BAT after they fail to sell on our own classifieds. I seems a BAT auction is like getting a PPI done by three or four knowledgable people.

[Robert Thiemrodt]

Any auction house that sold a fake, even if they did not know, should have to own that. If I misrepresent a house I am selling, my butt is in the sling. Another auction house story. A friend of mine has an exotic dealership. Selling everything from Porsches to Mercedes to Fiat's. He sent in paperwork to Barrett Jackson to have a 911 turbo in one of their auctions. The same day he sent in the signed paperwork, someone walked in his showroom and bought the car. He immediately called Barrett Jackson (same day he sent them paperwork) and informed them he had sold the car on his own. The lady he spoke with told him congratulations on his sale, she was happy to hear that. She then asked at what price he sold it for. When he told her, she informed him he would be getting an invoice form them for the commission he owed them. When he said they didn't even have time invested in his car, she said it did not matter. He paid it to uphold his reputation. I'm all for Capitalism, but that wasn't right!!!

[Vic Skirmants]

And now you know why some people refer to them as the "BJ" auction company.