CB Performance Weber Linkage Adapter Kit / Manifolds

[Greg Carter]

Has anyone tried the CB Performance Weber Linkage Adapter Kit?

http://www.cbperformance.com/product-p/3409.htm

My 356C has a set of Webers installed on it and the throttle arms are different from each other. They one on the left carb appears to be an older design (adaptation?) while the right side appears to be the stock Weber arm. These also cause an odd angle / set up of the factory drop links. I think the CB kit would allow me to have 2 identical throttle arms and also fix the geometry of the drop links but wanted to see if anybody else had used them.

While on the subject of Webers, CB also sells their own variation of the Weber intake manifold for the 356 / 912 and I wanted to know if anybody had used these as well.

http://www.cbperformance.com/product-p/3160.htm

I was looking for a way to eliminate the adapter plates with my current setup and install a set of intake manifolds that do not require any cutting or modification to the sheet metal to make them work. I'm not sure if these would fit that bill or if there are any Weber intake manifolds out there that do not require cutting / modifying the sheet to install.

Any help would be appreciated.

Greg

[C J Murray]

Do a search here for Weber linkage and Weber manifolds.

All you need to fix the linkage are 2 flat levers from Weber and to point one ball forward and 1 ball rearward with short extensions.

Generally Weber manifolds from Weber are poorly designed and don't flow as well as Solex manifolds with adapter plates.

I will post pics tomorrow.

[Greg Carter]

CJ,

Looking forward to your pictures. I just bought the car so I'm trying to sort some of the smaller things that need attention.

Let me know and thanks.

Greg

[Greg Bryan]

I bought some linkage arms from Redline purportedly designed specifically for use in the 356 and 912. They seem to work very well with geometry very similar to the solex.
Part no. 99005.314 and 99005.315

Sorry for the sideways pictures.
PS - if you find some decent manifolds, let us know. Most as CJ said are very poor quality, too bulky and clunky and the bores are 44mm at the top so that they can be used by 40s and 44s, which leaves a big step with the 4os that cant be good for flow.

[C J Murray]

I like what Greg has. I am pretty sure they didn't exist until relatively recently. Previously the offset levers available were made of very thin metal that could bend and be out of sync. Because there are strong flat levers available I used those with the balls facing opposite and spaced equal distances to correct for the cylinder offset and for the different lengths of the carb shafts, left vs right. There is a-lot going on there. The goal is to have equal incline of the drop links in all directions.

[C J Murray]

I have some observation on Greg's pictures. His manifolds look to be the big ones(not good) but sometimes pictures distort things. The idle bypass screws with lock nuts appear to be screwed out some where they should be gently seated to make the bypass non-functional. Greg's added spring is positioned where the idle speed screw lever will swing into it fouling it when at WOT. If you add springs, a good idea, look at the entire range of movement to make sure things don't hit or get over center or stuck wide open. Flipping the spring to enter the lever from the other side would help. Usually a diagonal, not vertical, attitude for the spring works better.

Did I pick enough nits?

[Vic Skirmants]

Hard to tell from the CB Performance photo which manifolds those are. The bad ones are very shiny, have a bad curve, and need the engine sheet metal trimmed.
There are proper Weber manifolds that look very similar to original Solex ones; dull aluminum finish, proper curve and no sheet metal trimming required.

[Ron LaDow]

Greg's added spring is positioned where the idle speed screw lever will swing into it fouling it when at WOT. If you add springs, a good idea, look at the entire range of movement to make sure things don't hit of get over center or stuck wide open.

It's worth time working on the spring geometry. You want pretty strong pressure at idle, since the the vacuum is trying to open the butterflies, but if you move the top perch too far to help that, it is possible to go over-center at WOT as Cliff mentions.
The ones on the Air Filter adapters took two prototypes to get the third one right.

[Greg Bryan]

I knew I was going to get busted - those were a set of core webers I had just to work out the linkage issue.
I can say that the manifolds shown in my picture are pure crap. Too bulky which makes spark plug access troublesome, angle on the head mating surface wrong which puts them too close to the fan shroud at the top, 44 mm intake side. I need to find some decent manifolds.
Also, the spring issue is important too. I'm very aware of spring interference since putting the spring on wrong on the solex will catch on the throttle shaft and hold the throttle full on - one tends to remember things like that .....

[Greg Carter]

Hard to tell from the CB Performance photo which manifolds those are. The bad ones are very shiny, have a bad curve, and need the engine sheet metal trimmed.
There are proper Weber manifolds that look very similar to original Solex ones; dull aluminum finish, proper curve and no sheet metal trimming required.

Any idea where to find the manifolds that don’t require any modifications? I’m running 40 IDF carbs and would like to get rid of the adapters.

Thanks for the other replies. I think I’ll look into the Redline arms to replace those I have. After additional research it appears the left carb had a Pellows type arrangement which is why it looks so different from side to side. I am having flat spot issues when I put my foot in it but those may also be attributable to the Dansk replacement distributor that’s currently installed. I think the advance curve on it may not be very good with Webers.

Greg

[Jeffrey Leeds]

If you know a great machinist, and fortunately I do, you can have him make a new carb/manifold adapters for the exact size of the carb throat base to avoid the mismatch that Greg mentions

[C J Murray]

Keep the Solex manifolds with the adapter plates. They work great. Your carbs are not original anyway so why worry about the visual of the adapters.

The pictures I posted are of 44IDFs on my 2133cc engine. The adapters and the Solex manifolds are ported/enlarged to transition from 44 to somewhat smaller ID to get maximum velocity at the 44 mm valve. In other words, not even when using 44IDFs would I use the big aftermarket manifolds on the street.

What venturi, main, idle, air, and emulsion tube are you running? Your manifolds are not causing a flat spot. Your linkage may be causing it, or your tuning set-up, or your ignition timing. What rpm has the flat spot and under what conditions?

[Greg Carter]

CJ,

I can't really answer your questions as I'm still digging into these carbs. I had planned to buy a rebuilt set of Zeniths / factory air cleaners but then decided to get the Webers tuned / running correctly to save a few dollars for the time being. I'll buy the Redline throttle linkages to sort that out and was looking into a one piece manifold option to clean up the look more than anything without having to hack up original sheet metal. I'm pretty sure the manifolds that are currently on the car are the factory Zenith ones for a C car.

The flat spot occurs right off idle (ie: when accelerating from a light or after shifting gears). The reality is, it could be any of the above mentioned issues. I still haven't looked at the jets to see what's there or checked accelerator pump volume etc. at this point.

Greg

[Vic Skirmants]

CJ,

I can't really answer your questions as I'm still digging into these carbs. I had planned to buy a rebuilt set of Zeniths / factory air cleaners but then decided to get the Webers tuned / running correctly to save a few dollars for the time being. I'll buy the Redline throttle linkages to sort that out and was looking into a one piece manifold option to clean up the look more than anything without having to hack up original sheet metal. I'm pretty sure the manifolds that are currently on the car are the factory Zenith ones for a C car.

The flat spot occurs right off idle (ie: when accelerating from a light or after shifting gears). The reality is, it could be any of the above mentioned issues. I still haven't looked at the jets to see what's there or checked accelerator pump volume etc. at this point.

Greg

How can you put those Webers on Zenith manifolds??

[Greg Carter]

CJ,

I can't really answer your questions as I'm still digging into these carbs. I had planned to buy a rebuilt set of Zeniths / factory air cleaners but then decided to get the Webers tuned / running correctly to save a few dollars for the time being. I'll buy the Redline throttle linkages to sort that out and was looking into a one piece manifold option to clean up the look more than anything without having to hack up original sheet metal. I'm pretty sure the manifolds that are currently on the car are the factory Zenith ones for a C car.

The flat spot occurs right off idle (ie: when accelerating from a light or after shifting gears). The reality is, it could be any of the above mentioned issues. I still haven't looked at the jets to see what's there or checked accelerator pump volume etc. at this point.

Greg

How can you put those Webers on Zenith manifolds??

There is an adapter plate between the manifold and the carb base. I assumed (never good I know) that the manifold is a Zenith manifold since the car is a C. Is this not an accurate assumption?

Greg