Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor??

356 Porsche-related discussions and questions.
Message
Author
Robert Stonerock
356 Fan
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:30 pm
Tag: Dr.Bob
Location: Charleston SC

Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor??

#1 Post by Robert Stonerock »

After 35 years of sitting my 356 is still not running even though I thought I finally had it finished. The only part I hadn't cleaned or disassembled was the Distributor and it showed all the signs of hardened grease and sticking counter weights. The spring retaining clip ring that goes on the cam shaft of my 022 distributor went missing from the time I disassembled it for cleaning to the time it was ready for reassembly. A hole in bubble wrap envelope that I put the parts in while transporting them for cleaning evidently did me in. Normally, I take photos of everything I disassemble, but this time my camera was not available and I knew I had a diagram downloaded. It was not for the Bosch 022 and I could find no other model that used this clip retaining ring. I went on line for hours searching for a photo or reference for the part. I couldn't even find a diagram or photo for the 022 Bosch distributor showing the part.
Does anyone know where to source the clip ring, or have a dimension for it????????.

Thanks,

Bob Stonerock

User avatar
Jacques Lefriant
356 Fan
Posts: 4602
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 1:50 pm
Location: Washoe county NV

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#2 Post by Jacques Lefriant »

 

Robert Stonerock
356 Fan
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:30 pm
Tag: Dr.Bob
Location: Charleston SC

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#3 Post by Robert Stonerock »

Thanks,'but the cam retaining spring clip is not included and not shown in the kit photo.

bob stonerock

User avatar
Bruce Smith
356 Fan
Posts: 1624
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:47 am
Location: Rochester, NY
Contact:

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#4 Post by Bruce Smith »

Bob,

I've got some but Stoddard may be able to get one to you sooner. Here's a link: http://www.stoddard.com/61660249000-nla.html

Let me know if you can't get one from them or this isn't what you need. Also, if you want to test the advance, I'll throw it on the Sun tester for you. Just the cost of shipping.

Bruce
http://www.cfi-auto.com
Attachments
CFI_Distributors_356.jpg
Bruce Smith

Robert Stonerock
356 Fan
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:30 pm
Tag: Dr.Bob
Location: Charleston SC

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#5 Post by Robert Stonerock »

Bruce,

I looked on line and Stoddard did not have the item listed. I will call Maurice to find out if they have them, but not listed. I have been unable to find a part number or size specification.

Thanks,

bob

User avatar
Bruce Smith
356 Fan
Posts: 1624
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 9:47 am
Location: Rochester, NY
Contact:

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#6 Post by Bruce Smith »

Bob - It's not the 'NLA-602-490-00 Distributor Drive Retaining Spring' ?
Bruce Smith

Mike Horton
356 Fan
Posts: 1260
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:13 pm
Location: Texas Panhandle South Plains

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#7 Post by Mike Horton »

Jacques Lefriant wrote:
nla-602-101-50_copy.jpg
Hi
http://www.stoddard.com/61660210150-nla.html
...there has been one in each Bosch shim kit I've used...
Mike

Robert Stonerock
356 Fan
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:30 pm
Tag: Dr.Bob
Location: Charleston SC

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#8 Post by Robert Stonerock »

The spring retaining clip is at the other end of the cam shaft. Wish I had misplaced the bottom one, as it is available. Maurice, form Stoddard, stated that the large E-Clip in the Bosch shim and washer kit is the correct replacement?? Was this a later change, or did someone earlier change out to a circular split ring??? I measured the groove and it is 14mm in diameter plus or minus a few hundredths??? I had an email that the E-Clip would not fit??? I don't believe mine had been apart before? I removed a split circular clip type ring as is found on the piston wrist pins. What am I missing???

Bob

Dave Erickson
356 Fan
Posts: 2190
Joined: Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:34 pm
Location: Monterey, CA

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#9 Post by Dave Erickson »

022 distributors are the same as BR18, so here is a BR18 diagram:
VJR4-BR18 Distributor.jpg
Note that there is no groove on the distributor shaft for any kind of circlip to hold the cam. The cam on a BR18 or 022 is held in place by the top plate (part 37 in the diagram), and the right clearance is obtained by using shims 27 & 28. The diagram leaves out the second set of shims 25&26 that go between the distributor shaft and the body.

031 distributors OTOH did use a round ring to retain the cam (shown in Jacques' photo of the repair kit, above). The 031 distributor shaft has a groove at the top. Is it possible that your 022 has an 031 distributor shaft installed?

Mike Horton
356 Fan
Posts: 1260
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:13 pm
Location: Texas Panhandle South Plains

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#10 Post by Mike Horton »

DaveErickson wrote:022 distributors are the same as BR18, so here is a BR18 diagram:
VJR4-BR18 Distributor.jpg
Note that there is no groove on the distributor shaft for any kind of circlip to hold the cam. The cam on a BR18 or 022 is held in place by the top plate (part 37 in the diagram), and the right clearance is obtained by using shims 27 & 28. The diagram leaves out the second set of shims 25&26 that go between the distributor shaft and the body.

031 distributors OTOH did use a round ring to retain the cam (shown in Jacques' photo of the repair kit, above). The 031 distributor shaft has a groove at the top. Is it possible that your 022 has an 031 distributor shaft installed?
+1... that diagram, as Dave says, is the closest to actual, than any other I've found... and it has the omitted pieces he describes, which must be present, for the clearances to be right... these are precision built assemblies!

...the difference in the BR 18, and 022, are the bigger shaft bore sizes, and brass bushings, in which the 022 shaft runs,
Mike

User avatar
Albert Tiedemann
356 Fan
Posts: 1229
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:46 pm

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#11 Post by Albert Tiedemann »

Robert Stonerock wrote:Thanks,'but the cam retaining spring clip is not included and not shown in the kit photo.

bob stonerock
Judging from what you have said and others, the cam retaining clip and washer needed is shown. The clip is above the large phenolic washer at the lower right of the diagram and the washer is above the two hairpin clips on the lower left of the diagram posted by Jacques. The clip is not used on a correctly assembled and configured 022 but rather on a 031. Use of the clip requires that the advance cam assembly be enlarged at the rotor interface to permit installation of the clip with an especially configured installation mandrel. Your statement that the diameter of the advance cam assembly of 14 mm is consistent with a BRS 383 and a 031 assembly. If you were able to remove the advance cam assembly without “shop aids”, I suspect that the clip and washer may not have been present. If the distributor drive shaft has a reduced diameter and a wisp of a “groove” for the retaining ring, you likely have an 031 distributor drive shaft fitted by others as has been suggested by Dave.

It would be prudent if you were to post a picture of the advance cam assembly and distributor drive shaft that you are trying to assemble into a 022 housing.
Last edited by Albert Tiedemann on Thu May 26, 2016 11:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Albert Tiedemann, C356C
"The Hermit"

User avatar
Albert Tiedemann
356 Fan
Posts: 1229
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:46 pm

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#12 Post by Albert Tiedemann »

Robert Stonerock wrote:The spring retaining clip is at the other end of the cam shaft. Wish I had misplaced the bottom one, as it is available. Maurice, form Stoddard, stated that the large E-Clip in the Bosch shim and washer kit is the correct replacement?? Was this a later change, or did someone earlier change out to a circular split ring??? I measured the groove and it is 14mm in diameter plus or minus a few hundredths??? I had an email that the E-Clip would not fit??? I don't believe mine had been apart before? I removed a split circular clip type ring as is found on the piston wrist pins. What am I missing???

Bob
I do not know who is holding the cue cards for Maurice, but that large e-ring does not have an application on the cast iron distributors for the Porsche pushrod engine. I would have to check to see if the suggestion to use it in lieu of the correct part is even feasible.
Albert Tiedemann, C356C
"The Hermit"

User avatar
Albert Tiedemann
356 Fan
Posts: 1229
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:46 pm

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#13 Post by Albert Tiedemann »

Bruce Smith wrote:Bob,

I've got some but Stoddard may be able to get one to you sooner.
Let me know if you can't get one from them or this isn't what you need.

Bruce
Please post a picture of what you have that you think he needs.
Albert Tiedemann, C356C
"The Hermit"

User avatar
Albert Tiedemann
356 Fan
Posts: 1229
Joined: Thu Apr 03, 2008 2:46 pm

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#14 Post by Albert Tiedemann »

Mike Horton wrote: ...the difference in the BR 18, and 022, are the bigger shaft bore sizes, and brass bushings, in which the 022 shaft runs,
Also the B+ interface. 022 accommodates the push on connector better as it embodies an anti rotational feature for the male spade connector and integral through the bore of the housing insulation. The BR 18 also has a longer fastener at this interface and incorrect finish to accommodate a ring connector and extra lock washer and nut. The very expensive insulator kits now only supply one 022 plastic connector and the orientation of the slot for the male spade connector is not as original. All easily and very discernible at the seriously judged event.
Albert Tiedemann, C356C
"The Hermit"

User avatar
Jacques Lefriant
356 Fan
Posts: 4602
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 1:50 pm
Location: Washoe county NV

Re: Metal cam retaining spring clip size for 022 Distributor

#15 Post by Jacques Lefriant »

DSC_0100.JPG
DSC_0102.JPG
Hi Robert
I think you are mistaken the only application for a 14mm clip that i have seen would be for the late magnetic distributors to hold the wheel.someone may have used a clip to raise the rotor but that is not normal.
j
 

Post Reply